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welcome to the true Hope cast podcast where we take a deep dive into mental Health's many physiological and psychological aspects this is the show

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for you if you're looking for motivation inspiration knowledge and solutions that's what we're all about here at true hope Canada and true hope Canada is a

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mind and body based supplement company dedicated first and foremost to promoting brain and body Health through

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non-invasive nutritional means for more information about us you can visit trueu hopec canada.com something new for the podcast

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is we're going to conclude each episode with a two to3 solution-based idea um

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question for each guest today's question is going to be what can we do right now to begin positively affecting our heart

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function today on the podcast I welcome Greg Elliot Now Greg is an exercise physiologist an osteopath and a

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entrepreneur who's on a mission to help everyone own their own health through education motivation and action ability

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he is a heart rate variability and wearable technology thought leader and speaker and he's also a sought after

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Healthcare practitioner Greg knows the struggle of juggling and keeping Health a priority prity he believes in a whole

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health approach that is supported by emerging technology so everyone can live a longer happier life today we're going

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to be discussing heart rate variability enjoy the show okay Greg welcome to True Hope cast

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thank you so much for being with me for being with us today how are you what's going well yeah it's good it's B busy

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Clinic day but um it's uh it's exciting to go in here I call this my playground where I get to be able to enact all the

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the things that I learn out in in uh in different areas of of Health wellbeing and and you know be with the team that

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supports that uh supports that Vision so it's it's phenomenal so it's uh it's a good day wonderful I'm glad to hear that

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well we're going to be discussing heart rate variability today I think it's a very interesting topic so many people be

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very interested to learn a little bit more about what that is everyone's got a heart rate so everyone should kind of you know be interested to see what that

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can actually offer people and at the end of the podcast like we always do we offer some solutions to a very

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particular question that's going to be able to impact people right away and that question's going to be what can we

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do right now to positively affect our heart function and we'll we'll get into that at the end of the show but to kick

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things off can you just give us a little bit of an introduction about who you are and what it is that you do please yeah

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so my name is Greg Elliot uh I'm an osteopath exercise physiologist and kinesiologist it's all fancy terms to

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I'm in physical rehab I help people that are in you know kind of chronic have chronic conditions related to pain or

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fatigue uh we deal in our Clinic with a lot of we call the functional uh illnesses or the invisible illnesses the

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ptsds the things that the traditional medical system don't have you know great resources in order to be able to to

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address uh so that's kind of you know in the areas of of where we are and where I fit in that is is I work on uh people

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from an osteopathic perspective and I incorporate a lot of uh newer Technologies um into what we do to be

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able to better you know provide direct interventions and Direct Care based on a bunch of data that we can capture to

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make the best clinical decisions as a team interesting you mentioned there about you you're helping people who have

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maybe not had the answers that they were expecting or had no answers from like a conventional model would you would you

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characterize yourself as like an alternative clinic or a compliment Clinic like how would you describe that

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and how um how are most people finding you are they finding you because they've

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had like this big lack of success with these chronic conditions that you know conventional medicine doesn't really

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have too many options for yeah the typical journey I would say is that we have individuals that first Go off into

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the medical system whether it's pain whether it's a symptomology that they have and and they go through all the typical traditional tests and and

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nothing necessarily comes of it right whether they either they try medications or get injections and not real success

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uh into there those people usually then end up into um you know a traditional you know physiotherapy maybe clinic or

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massage or try to look at some alternative uh type of of interventions um than the medical system provides and

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then usually from there if people are going down the rabbit hole a little bit uh further uh we do a lot of work in the

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local community of education and understanding around that and usually they end up if it gets more of a complex

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case they tell uh people to come see us um and so our biggest referrals are you

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know surgeons that say it's either you know this team or or we'll do surgery or other physiotherapists you know don't

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have all the tools and resources in their disposal the right Network to kind of bring over to us uh to be able to

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find us that way so we're kind of you know whole not the The Last Hope but kind of you know down the road a little

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bit when things are just really complex when things start to be piled on where it's not as simple as a a stretch or or

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a supplement or a dietary change is going to help resolve the solution so we take a very integrative approach uh we

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have you know medical doctors naturopaths we have physical therapists we have um osteopath massage therapists

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and we really do work as a team with these complex cases uh to get them into you know the right type of practition at

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the right time and and try to find the right information to make the best clinical decisions possible that's

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amazing can you tell me a little bit about the um relationship or the differences in the relationship you have

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with with your patients with your with your clients than they would experience in the conventional model you know I've

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been to the doctor before not for anything chronic or serious but you know it's like a 15-minute appointment and

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I'm trying to explain like shoulder pain for example that actually kicked off

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when I was 20 nearly 20 years ago and I just literally don't have the time to fill that that practitioner in with all

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that information for them to then you know sign off on tests or sign off on on

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medication or something else so how different is your relationship with your patients in your clinic than that they

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would have experienced in a conventional setting yeah typically uh the very minimal amount of time we spend with our

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initial sessions is an hour uh it doesn't matter if it's our chiropractor our massage therapist our physical

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therapist it's never less than an hour uh some practitioners are an hour and a half and what we want to be able to do

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is is determine kind of like a way more in-depth of history as to what's been done we want to know first off what has

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already been done that hasn't worked we want to know family history and I think the biggest thing that that we really do

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is I think we we look at Health as a holistic uh entity um we don't necessarily look at it as a siloed

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approach with our specific skill set you know osteopathy has certain tools in regards to manual therapy and exercise

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but that's only a piece of the the overall Pie when we see people with these complex conditions they are truly

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what we call the bioc psychosocial conditions all these aspects come into play as to where this person is right

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now whether it's the relationship they have with their family friends whether

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it's you know some past trauma that's happened over periods of time uh that's related to a lot of stress in their life

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poor nutritional choices you know uh exercise choices you know sleep habits recovery methods all these things come

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into play for these individuals and so when doesn't matter if they see me or another practitioner here we we try to

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understand the person and not the problem and really get after as to you know are they in the right room I always

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say that with my initial sessions I like with the whole the assessment piece like I don't treat the first session none of

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us really treat the first session it's it's all about figuring out the plan and the understanding and getting the right

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uh team together to to action something that's meaningful I always say like the reason why I do this is I want to make

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sure you're in the right room I have a certain skill set that I have but you know you may not need that at this

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specific moment in time it's it's about educating of how going through a divorce

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and having restraining on on your husband is going to play into your lower back pain how completely you know

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isolated you are as a result of coid plays into that mysterious shoulder plan that they came on six months after the

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lockdown happened all these understandings of of rather just going right to the intervention of getting

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understand not the problem but the person provides you know a significant

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amount of autonomy and agency for the individual to kind of Take Over Control of their their health and wellbeing yeah

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given that space and that time that you're able to give give these patients in their initial initial um sessions and

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then going forward do you find that they then because they are they're being listened to with like you know in-depth

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questions about their health history do you find that they're a lot more um invested in their own health to to kind

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of get better and they're actually playing a part rather than I just I just foresee somebody with you know long-term

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pain going to a doctor's office and they have a very short conversation and they come out with a prescription and they've

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just they've just they've just received something rather they're not really apart from explaining some things

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they're not really a part of the like healing process and then the prevention process you know it's all about

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education oh it's a gigantic piece of of of all this is the education piece and this is where again we take time to be

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make people understand what our plan is what our thought process is what we're trying to be able to do again because

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you know the traditional route is that if someone goes in there for you know to see a medical doctor with knee pain hear some sort of prescription it hurts when

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they runable then stop running it's like you know you're you're taking away things that they may relatively enjoyed

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it's like you know I can't do these things anymore and they kind of lose their you know not only their identity for a lot of people that are Runners

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that get told they can't run anymore right or to the point of like I have this problem that I just you know can't get rid of it's always going to be there

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and they kind of lose that ability of of I shouldn't progress I just need to be able to change my quality life around my

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problem where you know we always say here it doesn't necessarily matter what your goal is um if you want to say you

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want to run again fantastic it may not be a possibility but let's work on that

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goal to drive towards that there's certain criteria you need to be able to do we have certain you know uh um

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thresholds that we need to achieve based on min you know when we look at research of risk management and and injury

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prevention and all those things we make sure they hit all those criteria now if we don't hit those things then so be it but you know if their happiness relies

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in in in you know doing an activity such as that that is a gigantic piece I always we it's not good enough when

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people come to see us and they say you know I always ask you know part of this what you know what's your goal what's the ultimate vision and they kind of go

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I don't want to be in pain anymore that's not possible everyone's going to be in pain we're going to be in

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pain we're going to be feel tired at certain times we're going to be depressed or have low mood or feel anxious this is a part of of Life thing

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is they always get to the root of it of saying okay well when you're in these areas what does it stop you from doing

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what does pain prevent you from living your life the way you want to be able to live what does it what does it stop so

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if you are in pain like what is this where is your enjoyment stopped and so we get to that specific area and our

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goals to be able to achieve back that right it's very common of you know I still want to be in pain well okay well

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what happens when you're in pain well I can't play with my my grandkids or I can't go snowboarding uh being in Vancouver that's obviously skiing

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snowboarding are big things so what is the what has the symptomology stopped you from doing that is the goal to be

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able to achieve something way more quantifiable than you know not truly be able to happen is get out of pain not be

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fatigued anymore um but the education piece as you said of of that and really kind of laying things out I I heard this

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one quote and in you know a lot of our patients in in the chronic pain space um percentage wise when I've heard this

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this um pain researchers say this and it's so true is the best thing you can give someone with chronic pain is

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Hope yeah I love that I think yeah I think yeah you nailed it there in regards to there's a massive difference

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between being told that you can never run again or you shouldn't run again

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than the the hope that you might be able to do that like you know it's going to have completely different thought processes completely different

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biochemicals and neurotransmitters are going to be produced and you are going to you're going to be motivated rather

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than being completely crushed in regards to your process going forward and you're not going to be particularly motivated

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to do the necessary things outside of the clinic space that you're going to need to do that work if you've got that

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vision and the ability to maybe think about running again or being able to play with your grandkids on the floor

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painfree and getting really I guess kind of specific with what those actual things are then you're actually able to

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produce the necessary biochemicals to start like healing yourself from from the inside oh and then and you're you

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hit the nail in the head with that is that you you when you improve certain aspects in one area it's going to improve areas you know things in others

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we know was saying for instance we know that being more physically active is good for our mental health and wellbeing

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right it's like you know when you impact one area it can impact all the others as well to me what we're trying to disc

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we're trying to find as a as a as a practice as a clinic and as practitioners of saying well what's that

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one thing that's gonna you know have the most amount of effect through the whole health of the individual right there's

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again that three major component on of of think of addressing somebody that's going through symptomology such as pain

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that say it's not from a car accident it's not a broken bone it's it's a lower back pain that's there chronically it's

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the neck tightness that everybody gets or you know it's the fatigue on you know it comes and goes and and all that that

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perspective you have to look at the the biological modifiable factors psychological modifi modifiable factors

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and the and the social modifiable factors you got to figure well which specific area do we feel this person's

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depleted the most and then what we what can do to support them in that specific area in particular again they may not be

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in the right room with that side of things they may need a health coach or life coach they may need a clinical

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counselor psychologist with all these deepr rooted traumas as you know everything comes out the evidence now with Gabor and you know the body keeps

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the score and all these different things of understanding of symptomology can come from Deep rooted psychological

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things by connecting all these together it's it's you know we have to figure out which area of our health and well-being

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will provide the greatest amount of benefit because sometimes it's not oste osteopathic manual therapy it's not

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exercise it's not nutritional changes it's something outside of that realm and and what we try to be able to do what a

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good practicers try to do is saying you know is is that my area is that someone else's area do we need to refer out how

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can we best support you in in that area uh of your health well-being it's G make a massive impact to everything else

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beautiful yeah you know what I think's really amazing and beautiful is that when people really figure out what it

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their what their MO ation is what their hope is what their vision is about how they can be in the future it's always

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based around like other people like their kids their friends their families their partner it's never this

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like selfish weird Psychopathic thing like it's about it's about connecting

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with other people and they also think that's probably something that's missing in a lot of people's lives especially like coming out of the pandemic you know

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isolation and all these things where we're just not supposed to be in that type of a state we're just looking to

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connect with more people and if if you have that as the basis of your and the foundation of your healing you're going

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to be able to do amazing phenomenal things and I'm sure you've seen that over the years yeah yeah it's you know I

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kind of go through the progression of things I think you know you know ever since we've been alive we know the importance of you know physical activity

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exercise uh you know nutrition and sleep you know sleep obviously the pandemic I mean everyone read a Sleep Book uh

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during that time but we I think we that that you know there there was a lot of benefit we know those benefits uh and

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those have been established for long periods of time there's been a big obviously there was a big push 10 15 years ago around mental health

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well-being and understanding how that plays into Health how can we affect that the most uh various interventions and

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and I like to think as as you know as a practitioner seeing what Co did from a social standpoint when you remove the

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ability to connect and experience um uh you know closeness with somebody and and love uh for a lot of people that uh

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especially with seniors that were you know completely socially isolated uh and that I have some some clients that were

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pretty much completely social socially isolated other than a computer screen for most individuals and I'll never

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forget my my one client that I I kind of alluded to earlier where came to me with

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a you know just after the lockdown happened the first time we were able to see you know people again came with a shoulder pain that never happened in the

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years that I've seen her uh no mechanism for it all um you know biomechanically

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everything was identical like it wasn't a a a manual therapy or exercise problem and just just talking to her you know

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what things that resonated in my head when she goes I just don't remember the last time someone just gave me a

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hug yeah right and that like longing for connection and things and and so when

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things were opened up you know months later it slowly started to dissipate and now obviously it's been three years and

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never has come back again um into that so you can't underestimate the the importance of all aspects of health and

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well-being that's the hope is to be able to understand each of those and be able to to have whether resources uh other

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practitioners or a network around you that is able to address uh each of those factors yeah I I I really hope that the

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powers that be that control and manage us and Society here in Canada like take

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a long long hard look at what those lockdowns did to a lot of people and hopefully never do it again and learn

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from those what I my opinion was an absolute mistake and recognize the

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importance of movement sunlight connection talking with people all of those things are like like they seem

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they seem so simple and and benign but they they're absolutely the core the core of who we are as people and and

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within our community so yeah we'll see what happens in the future but I want to talk about heart rate variability so can

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you let us know a little bit what that is and why is it important yeah this is you know I'd say about 10 years ago um

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over a decade now this is kind of it was gigantic in sports performance really really big um into that around training

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management and but now I think it's I think people are being more uh just from the general consumers are starting to

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understand what harbe variability is and you know I think people get confused a lot of times with oh it's just it's

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heart rate right you know it's it's up and down with my heart rate and and uh it's not that what it is is that we're

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all familiar with heart rate with 60 beats per minute and and 90 beats per minute and things and uh but what heartbe variability is is the frequency

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of which each beat occurs right so Simon you and I can have a resting heart rate of 60 beats per minute right so

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identical resting heart rates over that period of time where mine beats like a metronome super consistent on the second

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every single second where yours goes up it speeds up and it slows down like it's nice Rhythm pattern where it goes up and

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and and down and you and I have the same resting heart rate but what research shows is that you are in a healthier

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happier more well State than I am which is very counterintuitive to what a lot

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of people think and even when I was talking to Medical Doctors and and uh I know a lot of medical professionals at

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the very beginning of of this discovery to me and trying to be able to get this word out I got a lot of blank confused faces and you know a lot of like no

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that's not it can't be true so it because it goes against of our idea of what health is is homeostasis our blood

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sugar needs to be controlled our blood pressure needs to be controlled our you know everything needs to be super consistent and and um repeatable but

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that's different with with heart rate variability uh we actually want more variability that means overall better

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physical mental emotional and social well-being for an individual amazing yeah I remember in

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anatomy and physiology I had a very kooky professor and we were looking at like you know just just the heart rate

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like the typical you know when you zoom right in and you just see that like one section of Beats and then he was telling me about how it's much more important to

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actually like zoom out and look at that over a period of like minutes and being able to see that variability that up and

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down because you know you you know you have your heart which is incredibly important organ and you need it to do

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different things at different times in different scenarios so like if you do need need you know you're at the gym you

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want to work out hard you need to be able to get your heart working efficiently in a high state but then you also want to be able to when you stopped

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and you're done it comes back in an efficient manner back to Baseline and also when you want to sleep you want to

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be able to like get get that into into a lower resting state and be able to like

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get it back up Etc so yeah it's very interesting that that variability piece is is much more valuable you know if you

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got versatile anything it's going to have a lot more function and value yeah

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and and you're you're completely right with again of speeding up and slow down to me that's where like you know health is is in the presence of stress like how

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do we know that we're healthier yeah the fact is is that in the same amount of stress that comes to us that we have as

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little reaction physiologically as possible so like for instance how do we know we're getting more fit you do an

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exercise test you run you know V2 Max or some sort of task where you're running a specific speed how do we know there that

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the program is working is that you do that same test three months later later and the exact same intensity in your heart rate's lower your perceived

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exertion is lower right and that goes through anything our ability to go through in public speak and not have our

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blood pressure go through the roof our ability to you know uh uh have tough Financial Times and be relatively in a

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in a neutral kind of calm state where we're not going up and down too much that's a picture of overall kind of holistic health that we can have social

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impact um stress impact emotional Impact Physical impact that our body maintains

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you know a very stable environment and heart rate variability to me is a really

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good proxy really good measurement of our homeostatic capacity our ability to maintain homeostasis from a general

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standpoint and why it's been so widely adopted in sports uh spaces in in

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corporate spaces in biohacking community all these people are using this values

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of this umbrella kind of biomarker to give really high quality information

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back at a non-invasive continuous way of are they making the right Health choices

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uh interventions and decisions uh that's going to impact their their health span is this heart rate variability

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marker being used by like conventional doctors would you say is there is there an instance where it would be done you

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know I've I remember when I go and do my annual health check be blood pressure and heart rate and then like that would

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be it and you know if I was kind of stressed out that day or I stressed about going to see the doctor it's going to be elevated right so is it actually

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used like heart rate variability in a in a conventional setting no uh especially in Canada um I'd say significantly more

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in the United States and in the last year I've done a lot of talks in in across the you know in California New

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York and in Florida and you're seeing more and more doctors uh with wearable technology and a lot of them have these

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you know wrist-based ring based wearable devices and starting to utilize them themselves and into their practice and see the the value of capturing this type

22:51

of information now I I don't know how effectively they're using it or how much they're using it uh into that standpoint

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but I mean even to see that walking around and about 50% of the medical practitioners that are there the doctors

23:03

and the nurses that are wearing some sort of wearable device and and are tracking it and when I do my talks come up and show me their their data um is

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you know very um very exciting for me uh for many different uh ways but being in

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Canada it's it's still you know um you know people wear these um you know

23:22

wearable devices and they think they're only good for capturing your steps and maybe some sleep um overall and and and

23:28

they're just kind of happy people are are conscious about their behaviors of health and well-being rather than trying

23:33

to utilize this information and make better clinical decisions where do you think that Trend in the States has come

23:39

from if you're saying that like you know you're seeing 50 60% of practitioners now are like being aware of they've got these devices on they're actually using

23:46

the data and probably um recommending them for their patients as well to be able to do that to take another step

23:51

towards into their Healthcare where do you think that you know what what what's missing in Canada that's happened in in

23:57

in that Trend in the US yeah it's it's I think uh the privatization of of healthcare makes

24:05

individuals and practitioners you know the move that for a lot of a lot of clinics now a lot of these clinics are out of pocket pay for for people cash

24:11

pay services uh to go out and be members of this and people are paying money sometimes I've heard in the neighborhoods of $100,000 a year uh to

24:19

these uh um you know to these medical clinics to kind of take over their health and well-being and so that always

24:25

makes people you know from the private business stand Point kind of be on The Cutting Edge of things and you know being the sexy do kind of thing to be

24:31

able to to expand uh into various areas and so this is a gigantic differentiator

24:36

and that thato where you know they can actually use this it's in the building codes now you can you can have wearable

24:42

products that are covered by Insurance in the US uh for various instances a lot of of people are are going that in

24:48

regards to remote patient monitoring uh remote therapeutic monitoring and so there's actually codes now that that are

24:54

available you start to be able to cover some of these costs as well which is which is phenomenal and so that's significantly lagging

24:59

behind in obviously the Canadian public system uh in particular uh where the traditional medical system it takes a

25:05

lot longer to to get these things they're not as Innovative uh around products and getting things as fast as

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possible um it's about obviously just addressing the needs at the specific time to to go forward with that but

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you're seeing the trends now in Canada there's there's significantly a lot more private medical centers that are coming up uh just in Vancouver alone I think

25:24

there was five uh in the last two years um that are that private pay medical centers that have medical doctors and

25:31

all these things that are out there with these huge kind of you know membership fees uh to be a part of them that are

25:37

coming out and so you're starting to see their interest in in wearable technology I've talked to a few of them in in regards to incorporating how to

25:43

incorporate those things so you're seeing the push from the private side but it's just the the the you know

25:48

differences of of of business from a private uh versus a public uh system and and the the way that you're trying to be

25:55

on The Cutting Edge of things um and and kind of create that Advantage from a business yeah it makes a lot of sense

26:01

that you know within that privatized model you you know you there's there's competitors you have to look at the market and just having to improve and

26:07

improve and be on The Cutting Edge all of the time if you want to continue having that clientele coming in growing

26:12

so that makes a lot of sense that's clearly a very very positive benefit of that and being able to get these devices

26:18

available to more people and even covered on insurance I mean that's just amazing I think that's really really cool um so so in your clinic which is in

26:25

Canada which is in Vancouver like how are you testing heart rate variability with your clients yeah so uh there's

26:32

many ways to kind of measure heart rate variability there kind three major ways that to be able to do it uh what was

26:37

typically done in a lot of the research early on is that people will come in at a specific time you lay down on a table

26:43

you would do reading um you know typically it's a FIV minute wash out period a five minute reading and you get your your data at that specific point um

26:51

you know time of update that was how it was traditionally done you know how it's done in Practical standpoint is three

26:56

different ways the first way is um a lot of uh psychotherapist clinical counselors use it from a uh looking at a

27:03

Stress Management standpoint and interventions they can do to help kind of regulate people's nervous systems they get into that parasympathetic type

27:11

state so we call it HRV biof feedback so what they do is they have a wearable device that has a live reading and they

27:17

do there different interventions at that time right so they do you know imagery or they'll do breathing patterns

27:22

different types of breathing patterns different type of things uh intervention wise to see how we can affect that nervous system uh the most to get into

27:28

more of an ideal type of State uh so that's one way to measure it and provide some interventions from more of a you

27:34

know acute Stress Management perspective like in the moment if something's very you know very stressful the two other ways that the

27:41

first way when when a decade ago when I started doing this um was uh a single point of time uh at home and so how it

27:48

was done before is you get a heart rate strap uh you know polar is obviously one of the ones that are out there that um provide high quality HRV data uh you

27:56

would have a mobile application you would wake up in the morning I'd always suggest people go pee because that provides a sympathetic response if you

28:02

have to have the urge to urinate so you go pee you come back you put your har strap on you open the app you press go

28:07

it does a reading anywhere from about a minute to five minutes you get your score and then you go on your day from more of a of a chronic standpoint so you

28:13

look it over periods of time um that's that's one way to do it the problem I found clinically with that is that one

28:20

people would forget sometimes in the morning they they wake up late or whatever so they go rush out and the

28:25

fact that if they knew that they they if they thought that their score would be bad whether they had you know late night

28:31

or some drinks what it may be they just wouldn't take it in the morning and I'm like I well I want that information I

28:36

want to show you when you make poor decisions what it actually does to your body so I wouldn't be able to have that data so what come out now which was you

28:44

know you know 10 years ago was not you know good quality uh data but uh now

28:49

wearable technology and SmartWatches are coming out that provide pretty high quality data High Fidelity data um um to

28:57

around HRV that we can measure that now nocturnally there was always the goal standard to hey let's let's measure HRV

29:02

through through sleep uh because that's when you're you're resting we see the recovery State and everything like that so there's a lot of wearables and and

29:10

smart watches that are out there now to provide some some High Fidelity data um

29:15

uh I'll suggest ones now I don't have any affiliations with any of these companies uh it's all from you know personal interest and and quality

29:22

information that comes back is the three ones that I'd recommend depending on on your preferences is is one would be if

29:28

you're okay with a ring based wearable is the aura ring it's very popular now it's probably one of the most popular

29:34

wearable devices that are out um it's a you can see it here I got a little example of it little ring based wearable

29:40

with a bunch of sensors measures sleep activity heart rate heart rate variability uh respiration body

29:45

temperature and all those things I like them because they don't hide behind algorithms they show exactly what the

29:50

the data that that's there allows me as a practitioner to better action uh the information that comes through uh as

29:56

well as they publish a lot of the research which is phenomenal the second uh is is purely a a businessto business

30:02

model so if you're a company or a clinic uh this is where you deal with them is it's a risk-based variable called biostrap uh they're at of Austin Texas a

30:10

relatively newer smaller company but they primarily deal with uh uh businesses uh but it's a risk-based

30:15

wearable long battery life and very similar that they'll give you a bunch of the raw data raw information so you can

30:21

make better clinical decisions they don't hide behind anything of these algorithms standpoint right so as a practitioner that's extremely iable yeah

30:28

the last one if you want more functionality where you want you know you just don't want something that has no display you want to be able to see

30:34

text messages and you know do different things with your watch and workouts and see things on on the watch itself is Garmin is is a great uh a great starting

30:41

point from that standpoint based on the quality you know originally they're they're okay but they bought a company called first beat in 2020 during the

30:48

pandemic and since then it seems that their quality I've in my team sometimes calls me the human cyborg because I wear

30:53

many wearables at one time to see all the data comparatively uh and they perform formed very very well um when we

30:59

had them uh against other um high quality devices like the or rig and the biostrap that they're very very close in

31:05

regards to the statistic so if you want more functionality from a smart a smart watch perspective garmin's a great

31:11

choice amazing some really cool recommendations so when somebody's wearing either this ring or one of these

31:17

other like watches or smart watches as a practitioner what are you looking for and what are the red

31:23

flags yeah it's a great question um so initially you know so they're wearing

31:30

their wearable device we suggest them do it uh and say you first I want a base line for these individuals you know it's

31:35

not just you know one time in the moment what does tomorrow bring it's it's usually about seven to 10 days depending on the individual where I want to see I

31:42

want to see where you know overall where that number sits in regards to the the demographic that they're that that

31:48

they're in right so uh if they have heart disease I spec certain things if they're 20 versus 60 I spec certain

31:54

numbers and so I have you know decade of experience of understanding what seems to be a good value versus a bad value

31:59

and I'll kind of play that into into everything else that I know about the individual um that's kind of the the the

32:05

first thing that we do from there based on the history we determine these low hanging fruit uh from that if it if it

32:12

HRV is not a uh in an ideal State um again if you're not familiar with numbers I I'll just throw numbers let

32:19

say you know 80 is good and and 20 is very bad uh if someone comes in there with chronic pain they're typically in

32:25

the 25 to 30 range which is significantly lower than we would like them to be and that's that's that's typical for someone that has chronic

32:31

pain for long periods of time what we want to use this information is that it doesn't necessarily matter what intervention they're doing we want to

32:38

see progress in their heart rate variability the reason why is because we want to get people that are in chronic

32:43

pain out of the sympathetic State we know a lot of you know conditions you know over sympathetic activation means

32:48

we're in a chronic stress State chronic stress state is is because of poor you know health habits or or or many

32:54

different things which can lead to the development of chronic diseases and illnesses and so we need to get them out of being more dominant sympathetically

33:01

into more parasympathetic so we'll we'll try what we think right we'll go on on you know what research shows what we

33:07

have experience with and we be able to provide them whether that's exercise whether it's nutritional supplementation changes whether that's sleep pattern

33:14

changes whether that's working on journaling or meditation or some sort of psychotherapy intervention whatever

33:20

necessarily intervention is we want to see that impact has on that heart rate variability that hases our umbrella

33:26

biomarker of saying are we making the right decisions or not so it comes back

33:31

to that it it provides the benefits of of that one it provides treatment e efficacy intervention efficacy for us

33:38

just because a an exercise works for 99.9% of people with back pain and alleviates back pain doesn't necessarily

33:44

mean it's going to work for that individual at in right in front of me I want to know that that's the case I

33:49

don't want them having to continue on with a specific plan and a specific regime is it actually doesn't provide any true objective benefit

33:57

obviously subjective is is important as well but I you know I really want to say C great you're feeling better your HRV

34:03

is so low there's other things that we need to be able to do to makeing sure that you know this pain stays away and

34:08

stays away for longer periods of time and you're less likely to get back into the cycle and that's when we start to open up into other different areas so I

34:16

love HRV and the fact that it determines kind of these big you know there's something big going on the difficulty

34:22

and why a lot of people have a hard time applying this is that it truly takes a holistic approach into this to be able

34:30

to understand the the person in front of you into to all aspects of their health and wellbeing to actually make a real

34:36

meaningful difference in in someone's heart variability yeah it makes a significant amount of sense to me that

34:42

if you're able to kind of gauge where somebody's nervous system is most of the time during the day you know if somebody

34:49

is in sympathetic fight or flight response most of the day they wake up feeling stressed and they're stressed

34:55

through the day and they go to bed feeling stressed that is most people um whether they're like conscious to it or

35:00

not being able to figure out whether like okay are you actually in are you actually putting your body in a healing

35:07

environment a place to actually heal you and take care of your pain take care of your aches take care of your dis disease

35:15

if you're spending 5% of your day maybe that's sleeping actually in a healing State you're never you're never going to

35:22

heal you're never going to get on top you're never going to be in a place where you feel amazing so makes a lot of

35:28

sense that you use this type of equipment to see like okay listen you're spending all of your day stressed out

35:33

you're never giving your body ability to actually heal and progress we need to start putting some things into your day

35:39

and and obviously you can show them this evidence you can show them this heart rate variability people like that you

35:45

know they'll be able to see that and it's like oh my gosh like look at that I didn't realize how like stressed out I am even like you know when I'm having

35:51

breakfast with my kids you know so it's okay so now we can we can start thinking about exercise we can start thinking

35:57

about meditation we can start thinking about having a cup of tea rather than having coffee and there's obviously lots

36:02

of things we can do within nutrition and diet that are going to like Spike our nervous system to be F firing or we can

36:08

do something to calm it down and give our body and the space and ability to to heal and recover so it's amazing

36:15

technology and amazing data I'm sure you'll be able to use I just want to play devil's advocate for a sec are there any negative um effects or aspects

36:22

about like wearable technology because I went through a stage of give me the latest Fitbit I'm into it let's go and

36:29

then I was like you know what I don't like this thing talking to my phone all of the time so I would take breaks and

36:34

then now I just I don't wear it I just wear a watch and I'm I'm in the market now I think I'm going to get an aura

36:40

ring because you're the third person I've spoke to who highly recommends the aing and it's kind of cool it's subtle

36:45

you know rather that than a watch that I have on my wrist that probably gives me too much information I don't want to be

36:52

checking text messages on my wrist I'm not that type of guy but um other are there any negatives that you've seen in

36:58

your experience of wearable technology oh um yes and and there are two

37:04

different branches in this and one we can probably talk forever on but the more obvious one is is very similar to

37:09

what you alluded to is that people come hyper obsessed about their data yeah right they said you wake up my sleep

37:15

score is terrible today blah blah blah what did I do and things like that it's like it's okay like it's it's all right

37:21

like don't be too obsessed that you had you thought you had a good night's sleep and you didn't right like even now I I

37:27

haven't checked my ring today and and that's the thing is because it's not about you know day-to-day type of things

37:32

it's about what are the trends where things are are going and the biggest thing like and I would say the mo the

37:41

one thing that weable provides individuals that I try to be able to instill into them is very you know we

37:47

talked about earlier is that agency and autonomy to what's going on it brings the awareness of of certain

37:53

things um awareness I find uh and you alluded to this in the just before is a

38:02

gigantic intervention in itself to understand where your body is of saying

38:07

like oh I didn't know I was stressed but if you look at this value it's like you're sitting in the bottom 10% of

38:13

people for your age category and you're relatively a healthy individual right we we know that become awareness like oh I

38:19

didn't realize that into that area awareness around specific things is is a huge a huge um um GameChanger for a lot

38:27

of people to be able to have that feedback but then be too obsessed with it is is is is detrimental and what I

38:33

like to say what I what I try to get people to do is I use the example of of like someone you know running a marathon

38:39

and they continuously wear a heart rate monitor right they're going through their training program they have a hard day easy day light day you know all

38:45

these things and they kind of follow this routine after you know few weeks even few months I can almost guarantee

38:52

that individual will know when they're running they'll have a pretty good idea of where their heart rate is yeah yeah right based on their intensity I'm

38:58

probably around 150 right now like and I'm sure you experien this with people it's like yeah they kind of know where they're at and that's the same thing is

39:04

I want people to be more in tune of of the the the behaviors that they do and the feelings that they have as to where their body is in certain areas of when

39:11

when they go through a stress State what happens and and so the whole point is like get to that awareness spot and you're doing various you know various

39:17

things you're kind of changing just remove the the data for a while right go live those Healthy

39:23

Lifestyles and when you want to be able to change something or alter something you want to make a big like shift in regards behaviors or whatever then you

39:29

can get back on it and continuously do it it's just being too obsessed on a on a you know day-to-day basis of of

39:35

numbers and things aren't going great it's like the world is ending you know it's it's like no no no people come to

39:41

me and say hey Greg my HRV is low like what do I do or my sleep score is bad or whatever it's it's like just all it is

39:46

is means you're a little you woke up you didn't fully recover so just take a little priority for you today go outside

39:51

for a walk and be able to get into nature just have a little more water eat get really good food and plan to go to to bed a little bit earlier if you're

39:57

going to have a you know workout later today maybe just decrease the intensity a little bit of it all just kind of do things that not over stress your body be

40:03

able to to prep your body for good recovery so that that's the kind of the the the standpoint that I have with with

40:08

individuals so that's one of the big things is that people just read too much into the into the data where it should

40:14

guide you and not direct you specifically to to do something yeah it's an informational tool right it's

40:20

there for you to be able to to look at and then rather worrying and stressing about what happened to like you what can

40:25

you do now in the future to you know totally the second big push that I've seen a lot

40:31

lately is about their health data and what are people going to be

40:36

doing with it who has the data who owns the data what are they going to do with the data that they have as we know is is

40:44

the next big kind of you know big push is the the big the value of Health Data out there is just growing and growing

40:50

and growing of how this type of information can be used by companies um for not very good things things um

40:58

around people and uh it's too invasive into their their life so people are are are very concerned about uh this type of

41:05

information being out there whether it's tied to their name or tied to any kind of identifiable uh information that

41:11

could get back to to them and and if that information's out there you know if someone buys it are they going to Target

41:16

me with certain things based on what they know that they know I've have poor sleep and all of a sudden you know

41:22

Facebook buys the data and I'm GNA get bombarded by sleep pills and and uh and all that right and so that's

41:29

that's another big concern with individuals un wearable technology is they don't want necessarily have um get

41:35

uh their health information exposed out to to companies uh to be able to be purchased uh on you know uh on their

41:42

behalf uh and so that's a big concern so you're seeing a lot of companies actually there's a company a new variable out there called uh now watch n

41:49

o WC like like no watch that's out there where um they say they don't own data uh

41:55

they're purely there that the fact of like it's for you so like they can't sell your data uh they don't own it at

42:01

all it's um completely uh for you that's out there so there's a lot of companies making pushes around uh um not owning

42:09

the the Health Data but more of like you know what the what the app can do and how it can help uh individuals in

42:15

general which is which is great um but it hasn't been that way for a very long period of time because you know

42:21

companies that are smaller to try to make waves they want to be able to own this data because it's valuable to

42:26

bigger companies to be able to purchase that's really cool that's a great answer so you're talking about people who just get way too like

42:32

orthorexic about the about the the data and the information and stress out even more when it's supposed to be a tool to

42:39

help you kind of like get a handle on your stress and also people who are maybe a bit like you know freaked out about where that information where that

42:44

data might be going and if you're worried about that then that there's clearly companies out there that are facilitating that need you know like you

42:50

see it with cell phones as well there are people making cell phones that won't capture your data as well so that's

42:55

amazing that's really really cool I just want to I just want to touch on supplements heart Health Nutrition and

43:02

all of that you know like here at Europe Canada we have we have six products um our Flagship product is a is a broads

43:07

Spectrum micronutrient formula called empow plus and it's got 35 Medical journals government funded um from I

43:13

think 12 different universities from around the world one of the most studied micronutrients on the planet and we

43:19

always talking about it on the show and within our social media streams and even just within the team here at true hope

43:25

about how how um how important it is as a f as a foundation within anybody's Health you could be a super fit

43:31

ultramarathon dude um or you can be somebody who's sick and dealing with

43:37

chronic disease you're going to need to take care of your foundational nutrition you know like there are an Untold amount

43:43

of things coming into our world every single minute of every day that are you know depleting us of nutrients our soil

43:49

is not what it was you know our food is not giving us the nutrients necessary anymore so when it comes to heart health

43:55

and supplementation what what are some of the things that you focus on obviously it's going to be different with individuals but is there like a

44:03

like a standard protocol that you work people work with people with yeah that's a that's a really good

44:09

question yeah I mean the first thing is is we always uh do a comprehensive amount of of blood work right so that's

44:15

the first thing we we able to do from from there uh depending on on on what's going on right because you know heart

44:20

health can be impacted by you know high blood sugar uh in regards to hypertension and there's other kind of

44:26

you know primary things that could that can impact the heart so we got to figure out okay well what's stressing the heart what

44:31

mechanism is is uh is really impacting it the the absolute most and we be able

44:37

to start from there um you know our naturopaths and medical doctors here do a phenomenal job in regards to

44:42

supporting uh on the supplementation side whether through uh uh IVs or or

44:47

through uh various uh uh products from there but uh from a from a personal

44:53

standpoint uh what I've you know uh from a from a purely heart health perspective

44:58

you know obviously we've seen phenomenal stuff from uh funny enough from from vitamin D is been big one regards to to

45:05

heart health which is which is quite surprising uh for individuals we see that uh being uh quite important uh we

45:10

also obviously deal the omegas and be able to to address from there but it really from a general standpoint we

45:16

don't necessarily it's very similar to the how we deal with from a manual therapy perspective we don't necessarily

45:21

have a like a specific protocol someone comes to me with back pain I don't have back EX exercises and we try to apply

45:27

that necessarily you know to our our nutritional supplementation it's more of yeah we have the the the heart is not

45:33

functioning but you know is there Downstream of facts as to why that necessarily may be the case and then we be able to kind of go from

45:40

there really cool yeah I think that the fact that I think most people are nutrient deficient in some Manner and

45:49

you know we're looking at like especially our youth dealing with so much anxiety so much depression at the

45:55

moment and significant amount of it when you look at people's blood work and you look at you know big cohort studies of

46:01

individuals you know the links of vitamin D deficiency and depression are insane The Links of mineral deficiencies

46:07

and depression and anxieties is insane so being able to take a product like um like empow plus which is you know very

46:13

specifically made and kated we keate our minerals for four days other companies do it for four hours so our our minerals

46:21

are getting into the getting into through the blood brain barrier and being able to affect the whole body which is obviously very very important

46:27

when a lot of deficiency and a lot of imbalance is happening you know psychologically within the brain such a

46:33

huge aspect and we were talking off air before we went live today about your

46:39

practice this this holistic integrated functional practice that you have um maybe you could just touch on a little

46:45

bit more about like what else you offer there because I want to talk about um before we finish up here the difference

46:52

between the type of practice you have and the type of Health healthare that most people are getting in Canada CU I

47:00

before I moved here seven years ago people were telling me that Health Canada sorry that Canada's Healthcare is

47:05

like the best in the world I was like okay that's interesting because people say that in England about the NHS and

47:10

sure it's free it's not free because we obviously pay for it with our taxes but

47:16

amazing people working within it but like they're just like stretched to the limit in regards to what they can deal with because 95% of people going into

47:23

the NHS or probably through um doctors's off here in Canada they're dealing with chronic issues that they're not going to

47:28

find an answer for so can you tell us a little bit about your practice how it differs and maybe like your vision for

47:36

the future of healthcare within within Canada yeah so so we really try to be able to coin you know the term with us

47:42

as as an interdisciplinary Clinic it's not a multidisiplinary clinic multidisiplinary to me just means there's a bunch of different practices

47:48

under you know and practitioners under Under One Roof and and typically what that is is everyone kind of runs their

47:53

their own show uh they kind of have seen they'll see their patients they come and go it's it's a spot for you know those

47:59

individuals to to come in and get treated and then leave and what we try to instill is it's very much this interdisciplinary model where people

48:06

come in it is is almost always the case that they see another type of practitioner here because there's some

48:12

other tool that needs to be uh um you know introduced in order to be able to

48:18

kind of make a meaningful impact for that individual and so we really do try to talk with one another um to be able

48:24

to connect with these things and we have you know you know people that own a case a case manager for that that specific

48:30

client or patient and then we have the discussions this team and we really work uh uh very good to one another and so I

48:37

might say to a point of you know someone comes to me with certain issues I say okay well you know first you know based

48:43

on what we find acupuncture is probably the best intervention that we need for that specific point because of ab and C

48:48

what we're going to do is we're going to send you over to Sherry you go with her we'll probably need about three to five sessions you know we have the same kind

48:54

of EMR system I go talk to Sherry what the plan is you know and then when she feels she has a good grasp what's going

48:59

on she communicates me when to come back and what the next steps are and how we kind of involve other people and where deficiencies may be where we need to get

49:06

tested uh through the different practitioners and we kind of you know go on from there the people feel very well

49:11

supported they feel heard and taken care of uh they feel that they're trying to be able to get to the root cause of

49:17

their problems and that's just not necessarily a case you know in Canada it's you know more than the US it's extremely siloed in its care you know

49:24

you come see a you know medical doctor it's usually to put the point of what's your symptomology and here's a

49:29

prescription for your symptom you know from a physical therapist you know it's it's lower back pin here some lower back

49:35

stuff I don't necessarily kind of be able to put all those pieces together and that's what we're trying to be able to accomplish is that kind of integrated

49:41

model and you're seeing that push more and more and more uh uh especially in

49:46

the US in particular uh but you're seeing that kind of you know from the Grassroots now talking to different EMR

49:52

systems electronic medical record systems uh talking to different companies you're seeing the trend going

49:58

that way a lot of people are saying yeah it's it's already started it's already going that route of you know these type

50:04

of membership models where you're part of this team and it's like it's all areas of your health that are being addressed and not just seeing you know

50:11

self-directed where I my shoulder hurts I think I need to go see a chiropractor or my you know I'm feeling fatigued I'm

50:18

gonna go see a naturop path it's like well we don't know what the deal is it's not trying about to be self-directed you

50:24

go to one place have all these team members work together to figure out what type of practitioner type of of of care

50:31

that you need individually uh based on your your needs right now that we can assess and we'll start that route and be

50:37

able to add the other layers uh when it's ready uh for that individual to do so very cool I remember when I was

50:43

studying nutrition in Victoria and when I finished and I started my practice up

50:48

I think every other client I needed to refer to somebody I need to refer to at least two other people and it was

50:54

usually like a need need to go and see a herbalist and go and see an acupuncturist but unfortunately for them

50:59

in the situation we in right now they have to go to like one part of town to go and see an acupuncturist pay like 120 bucks for a

51:06

session fill out their huge intake form and then go to the other side of town to go and see a herbalist and do exactly

51:11

the same thing and like it's not affordable you know like it's very very expensive to be able to do that also

51:17

time is a massive Factor so going to be being able to go to like one space one Clinic where these practitioners are

51:24

working with each other and referring within there and sharing that information where you've kind of just got this one intake form and you're

51:31

being able to um have sessions with a practitioner and you're adding to that and you're conversing it's honestly the

51:38

only way that Healthcare can become what it's supposed to be I guess in in the

51:43

future and yeah there's there's people like James mascow in in the in in in the US with a functional Forum like doing

51:49

amazing stuff with functional medicine and um it's clearly working over there it's clearly something that is being

51:55

taken on board in in the US and I just hope that something like that comes over to comes over to Canada it's clearly

52:00

working now because you've got your clinic over there which is in Vancouver which is amazing which we'll talk about just before the end of the show like

52:05

where people can connect with you we have a lot of listeners from BC but just to finish off with the show like we're

52:11

going to we're going to clarify and get into the question a little bit more that we asked at the top of the show to give people some solutions like right now

52:18

what can they do and the question is what can we do right now to start posi positively affecting our heart function

52:26

yeah uh I mean I always suggest is we always kind of started off with that Baseline right you got to be able to do

52:32

that and I think one of the things and you've seen this Lots is you know people get blood work done and be

52:38

like oh I had a comprehensive amount of blood work done and you start getting to the nitty-gritty of it all and and and I

52:44

thank Peter AA to start to be able to to you know be the thought leader around this and probably know verbalize this

52:49

and get this in front of most people there's a lot of testing that's not necessarily done in the traditional system that can provide immense value

52:56

and understanding and and and um and action towards certain aspects of your

53:02

health and well-being so we know what direction to be able to to go to so that's the one thing I'd say is is

53:07

getting that Baseline of blood work and and and using wearable technology to help with know just understanding that

53:13

awareness piece I don't see it as a diagnostic thing it's not be able to say oh I have a heart problem I have this I

53:19

you know I am it's just it's about saying as you make various alterations in your life you have something that

53:24

kind of you know understand that you're making the right choices uh you know based on that that wearable technology

53:30

so so those are two things I'd say from from a perspective from a baseline I'd always highly suggest uh uh people

53:36

getting from there it's it's really understanding uh and getting yourself uh

53:43

a lot of self-discovery around awareness of kind of where your your loow hanging fruit is and one thing I always explain

53:51

to individuals is that I mean if you if we look at our lives all of us can improve our physical activity improve

53:57

our nutrition and improve our sleep improve our Stress Management our social

54:03

connections and all those different areas and you know heart health it's like you know to me this is it's the

54:10

it's the center of our our being this is where you know everything kind of runs through and across and and and so it's

54:17

super important to understand that so getting blood workk to understand of kind of where you're at and

54:22

understanding the other important you know impacts that can have on our on our heart function um our heart function can

54:29

be altered by our emotional state our our social State our connections with people it can increase the the effort

54:35

that it it provides our our physical being um for sure uh so so having a a

54:42

truly holistic understanding of you is also uh super important for for heart

54:48

health and well-being and and to me the the founding pillars if you kind of one

54:54

framework that I like to to look at is maso's hierarchy of needs it's not necessarily saying one thing is more important than another but masle came up

55:01

with this kind of hierarchy of of our our needs that we need as human beings and and kind of layer things on and in a

55:07

a very nice way that give a good framework to understanding of of where to go so I'd really look if you're not

55:12

familiar with it I I would look it up but it always starts with the base of the physiology right it looks at physical health exercise physical

55:19

activity nutrition and sleep and so from a heart health perspective uh even from a General Health perspective it's about

55:26

kind of dialing those things in um you know with with the standards that we know that are that are positive uh for

55:32

uh heart health make sure those are implemented um into that uh those are

55:37

required the least amount of effort in order to change more than you know self-actualization or our confidence

55:43

self-confidence our our emotional regulation safety needs all these things

55:49

uh that the the hierarchy shows but that Foundation that pillar of our physical health and wellbeing our modifiable

55:54

factors of our exercise our our sleep and our nutrition getting those dialed in with some some high level

55:59

professionals and get them a a good amount of blood work to be able to kind of frame out what where you need to be able to improve is is something you need

56:06

to everybody needs to start with amazing great recommendations yeah we're so blessed these days to be able to have

56:12

like unbelievable access to people like Andrew huberman and P Peter ater and

56:17

like Tim Ferris Jo Rogan I suppose as well like these people having these amazing conversations like the lit

56:23

literally Stanford professors that you can listen to for three hours every week on Amazing all you know topics that are

56:30

just like on Trend and they go into the most wonderful amounts of in-depth um

56:36

detail so depending on your on your knowledge whatever you want to do there's just such amazing information

56:41

and education just like out our fingertips just to like B bounce into podcast so I really appreciate that um that information that's a really great

56:47

recommendation so how can people how can people connect with you Greg and where tell us about the clinic a little bit

56:54

where is it yeah so our Clinic is right downtown Vancouver at Nelson and how um so if you're in the the BC area or

56:59

Vancouver you can come see us and again very much an interdisciplinary it's called fit to train um there's a bunch

57:05

of different practitioners here from all different uh backgrounds and it's a truly integrated clinic and we like pointing people in the right direction

57:11

whether it's with us or with other people so if you're interested of of getting kind of like a holistic uh

57:17

assessment uh definitely come on down and check us out if you want more information kind of around you know

57:22

wearable technology and health and well-being of of around that standpoint understanding those things you can go to

57:28

to Greg la.ca I just just launched it so there's some information there of past podcast I'm going releasing a lot of you

57:34

know free ebooks over the next few months uh here so people can access to what HRV is and and how to improve it

57:40

and how to use wearable technology for their health and well-being provide some free resources for individuals to to

57:45

improve their uh their health and wellbeing and U you know get that health agency or that that um that control over

57:51

their health and well-being that that is so important Amazing Greg that's it that was

57:57

wonderful thanks so much for your time today I really appreciate it I'm really excited to get this episode out to people it's going to be really helpful

58:03

well thank you very much and I know it you know podcasting is a lot of work uh but I must say you've you've done a phenomenal job with all the guests

58:09

you've had at this point to providing high quality information to to everybody so uh my hope is obviously you keep going with this all because you're

58:15

providing immense value it's people like you and what you guys are doing that really is going to kind of be at the

58:21

Forefront of this of this change uh so thank you for for uh making the effort to be able to do this well I really

58:27

appreciate that Greg thank you very much well that is it for this episode the true Hope cast the official podcast of

58:33

true hope Canada I'll will make sure that there are um there information in the show notes you can connect with Greg

58:38

and check out his staff and check out the clinic there in Vancouver but that's it for this week we'll see you

58:48

[Music]

58:53

soon