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welcome to True Hope cast the official podcast of true hope Canada where we take a deep dive into mental Health's

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many physiological and psychological aspects this is the show for you if you're looking for motivation inspiration knowledge and solutions and

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that's what we are all about here at true hope Canada and true hope Canada is a mind and body-based supplement company

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dedicated first and foremost to promoting brain and body Health through non-invasive nutritional means for more

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information about us you can visit truehopecanada.com we have another special episode of True Hope cast for

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you today lawyer Sean Buckley and VP of true hope Canada Mr David Stefan are going to be discussing the vital

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Integrity issue within the Natural Health industry with everything that is happening with Bill c-47 we see some

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companies stepping up and stepping out and making a stand but we also see other companies sitting back into the shadows

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and waiting for the storm to pass but if you have any knowledge of this bill and what is going on within within the

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Natural Health industry within Canada you know that that storm is not going to pass without grip fight and

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determination from everybody in the industry so I encourage you to share this episode like it comment give us a

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rating on Spotify and iTunes if you can but other than that enjoy the show

1:11

welcome we are back on to discuss issues surrounding the Natural Health industry

1:16

now over the past three decades there has been many attempts to try to dismantle and to control and to prevent

1:25

Natural Health products from being available to the Canadian public and today things are even worse than we

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could have ever thought that they would have gotten but in such a short period of time where literally the wolf is on

1:39

our doorstep harm has not yet fully taken place in

1:45

relation to the new things that have been put into place by Health Canada which we are going to be talking about

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and we are going to be basically the purpose of this podcast today

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which is by the way the 130th um

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Edition or episode of True Hope cast which is the official podcast for True

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hope Canada the reason why I'm bringing that forward is that some people will be viewing this today through that venue

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but some of you are viewing this through um the channel of nhppa.org some of you

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are going to be viewing it on my personal Facebook page as well so just so you're aware this is going out to multiple streams and we are going to be

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bringing forward the issues that are at our doorstep

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with also action plans that can be put into place to prevent

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this overall issue from basically preventing you as a Canadian from having

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access to life-saving and therapeutic Natural Health Products that the

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majority of Canadians rely on on a daily basis so as part of this again we are

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bringing on Sean Buckley he's a constitutional lawyer he has had a long journey in

3:05

relation to Natural Health Products he has a phenomenal story and we're going to get him to touch on that in relation

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to how he first came on the scene um when it comes to Natural Health Products going back over 30 years ago

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and we're going to talk about that or maybe it's just under 30 years ago we'll have him clarify that so we're going to

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bring him on and then we're going to get into the issues surrounding this we're going to be talking about the different

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elements that Health Canada is moving forward with that is going to ultimately harm your ability or prevent your

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ability from getting Natural Health Products we're going to be talking about the psychology behind it and and the

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response that Canadians will naturally have many Canadians will and and um as well

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as talking about the Integrity of the Natural Health industry and why some companies are getting involved in this

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to alert you to these issues and why others are remaining silent

3:59

so without further Ado we're going to bring Sean Buckley on

4:05

hey good morning Sean good morning David how are you I am well thank you again for for taking the time to be on

4:12

um many of my followers personally will will uh will recognize you as we've had this you know long journey together

4:19

um even on a personal level over the last 10 years in relation to other court matters

4:24

um others will recognize you from you know you representing true hope uh

4:30

almost 20 years ago uh it was yeah it's hard to believe it's that long isn't it so but I'm trying to remember like that

4:37

criminal trial I think it was like early 2000s it really started in 2003 when Health

4:43

Canada came in and shut everything off at the border for for the 3000 Canadians that were using our products at the time

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and then they came and created us at gunpoint and that's I think you got involved shortly thereafter and then I

4:56

think it went in 2006. you know I I thought it was a

5:02

little earlier than that but it in any event um it was a long time ago so I can say

5:09

this much it was a long time ago but you don't seem to be aging so we'll talk about that

5:15

it's the EM Power Plus so awesome well thank you again for coming

5:21

on um you know just just for the the viewers um you know I was on a meeting with you

5:27

uh not that long ago where um you kind of I believe it's a meeting

5:33

or a podcast I don't think it was last podcast that we knew wrong but I watched you where you were talking about your

5:39

history which was really quite compelling as to how you got involved in any of this in relation to Health

5:46

Products Health Canada um so if if you don't mind can you you

5:51

know well sure and I I like to tell the story because we're going to be talking about kind of how health Canada right

5:58

now is taking is maneuvering to take Natural Products away and the story

6:03

helps drive home actually how this is a life and death issue so the paradoxes is the government saying you need strict or

6:11

regulate we need stricter regulations to protect you but the reality is is the opposite it's

6:18

going to lead to death and it's going to lead to harm and our current halfway point to the drug regulations that we're

6:24

in now is already led to death and harm so yeah so it

6:29

heck it's um back in 1994 I'm working at a firm and and um

6:37

Health Canada hires that firm to defend itself against a lawsuit

6:42

by that was brought by herbalist named Jim Strokes so Jim Strauss was

6:48

a herbalist in Kamloops and he was importing herbs from the United States that were perfectly legal

6:55

for anyone to import but Health Canada is trying to shut this fellow down and actually you know would

7:02

refer to him to me as their counsel as a road kerbilist

7:08

and what they explained to me

7:13

and I'll just say that my background I grew up in a family we you know you got

7:19

sick you went to the medical doctor and the idea of you know Natural Health

7:25

Products you know other than vitamins being a good idea uh was not very meaningful and you know

7:31

I don't even remember now but you know likely I was on zero supplements in fact not likely I would have been taking no

7:38

vitamins nothing that just was not part of my world and health Canada is explaining to me

7:46

that this Rogue herbalist is actually and if you can believe this David actually selling unapproved

7:53

treatments on the market and is this ever dangerous

7:59

because they're unapproved they have not been approved of by Health Canada and I saw that you were smiling there

8:06

um your audience should know and I didn't know at the time that basically there wasn't a single

8:12

approved product natural product in Canada because we had we have the Food and Drug Act

8:18

and we have drug regulations or we had drug regulations but they were written

8:24

for chemical drugs which is a total def different ball game than garlic extract

8:30

or oregano oil or vitamins and minerals like when you create a novel chemical and you

8:36

introduce it to the human body we've learned that that's one of the most dangerous things you can do I've five of our three of our top five

8:45

leading causes of death although two of them are hidden from the public you can dig for them and find them are related

8:51

to chemical pharmaceutical drugs so it's one of our biggest risk factors in fact

8:56

for every age group I think you know a 10-year age groups except for one in Canada your your biggest risk is going

9:04

to the doctor's office oh I want to touch on that real quick I want to throw up some numbers because this is a matter that I had to deal with

9:10

a number of years back when I had people coming at me media was attacking me for being on the you know the the speaking

9:17

circuit for all these different Health shows across Canada and and they were basically saying who are you to be even speaking about matters of Health you've

9:23

got no credentials well okay well take a look at the experience take a look at you know where we come from and you know

9:29

the numbers speak for themselves in relation to how many people get better you know compared to going to the doctor's office but these numbers were

9:34

coming out and in relation to isrogenic uh deaths I had to do a bunch of digging and what was interesting is you know

9:40

Canada has about one-tenth the population the U.S does and the numbers mirror perfectly in relation to the

9:46

deaths uh surrounding properly prescribed medications which is a hundred thousand people per year in the

9:52

US are dying due to properly prescribed medications are taking taken as prescribed yeah and

10:00

they're dying ten thousand in Canada and then in relation to Medical mishap which was obviously a large theme in relation

10:07

to the the trials that you and I were involved in from 20 2014 actually uh all

10:12

the way up until last year um medical mishap uh 300 000 people per

10:19

year in the U.S are dying from medical misadventure or medical mistakes and

10:25

that's only what's being reported because you know how often is a doctor actually going to report you know oh I

10:31

caused the death right so it's it's definitely underreported but 300 000 in

10:36

the US thirty thousand in Canada you group them together and you basically between Canada and the US you've got

10:43

um almost a half a million people every year dying because of going to the

10:49

hospital and taking the medications that they're prescribing but sorry go ahead when you're talking deaths you're not

10:55

even talking injury no not talking Angela just solely deaf yeah

11:00

so you know so I I didn't understand that

11:05

the the chemical drug regulations weren't applicable they weren't designed

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for natural products so in fact you couldn't get through the drug approval process

11:17

and so basically every single natural product was technically illegal now there were

11:23

some exceptions you had some multivites and stuff like that that had drug identification numbers there were like

11:29

vitamin monographs and and the like and there actually had been a very short period of time where Health Canada like

11:36

totally loosened up on dens for natural products and there were still some of those Legacy ones on there but for all

11:42

intensive purposes if you walked into a health food store back in 1994 you would be hard-pressed

11:50

to find a technically legal product so they were completely unregulated

11:57

um and it's funny we're in a campaign and I'm being told don't use the word unregulated but we were completely unregulated the whole industry was and

12:05

we so Health Canada is telling me back in 94 well can you imagine this this

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herbalist is selling an unapproved unapproved treatments it isn't even Dawning on me well wait a second they're

12:17

all unapproved you can't get approval what are we talking about but they're their point was is he was treating

12:25

heart disease a very serious life and death condition with an unapproved treatment and this

12:32

was dangerous because people can die or people their condition can get worse because they're not getting the approved

12:39

treatments right and you know I'm drinking that Kool-Aid

12:46

and I'm buying that story and I go to court and I have the lawsuit dismissed

12:53

and because he was suing in the wrong Court

12:58

so then I start my own firm and in another effort to shut this herbalist Jim Strauss down

13:04

um The Province charges him with practicing medicine with her license because the

13:10

ACT that gives the doctors their medical Monopoly says only doctors can practice medicine

13:16

and it defines the practice of medicine as including treatment claims

13:21

and Jim was was quite religious about saying he could

13:27

cure heart disease he literally drove around in a white van covered in Red Letters you know on the side we cure

13:34

heart disease like he could not he could not be quiet about it you know I'll share why he couldn't is

13:42

so he um first of all you have to understand he was an older gentleman so he flew for the German Air Force in

13:48

World War II he was from Austria and his family had been traditional healers for four centuries

13:55

and he was trained by his grandparents so he was trained to be a traditional healer

14:00

by you know a family with four centuries of expertise in traditional healing he

14:07

was an expert like you you can't you can't be trained like that anymore like it's interesting David like when we went

14:15

into this halfway drug model of the natural product regulations

14:20

Strauss herb company was beside themselves at how poor like how their

14:26

quote the quality of their heart drops where it's going to drop so much because under the the natural product

14:33

regulations you'll have an active ingredient

14:39

in you know in one of your herbs and you will test that batch of herbs for the strength of the active ingredient and

14:46

then adjust your formula based on the strength well before the natural aquatic

14:52

regulations when you're a master herbalist trained in the ancient Traditions you do it by taste

14:58

you taste the herbs and your taste is more than just that active ingredient because there's more than like there's

15:05

so many things going on that is there's not just one active ingredient and they work in Synergy and somebody trained in

15:12

tasting for strength makes a better product than somebody relying on a lab test and and they

15:20

literally were grieving that their product is so much worse under these

15:25

regulations than it was before the regulations it's still good it's still they still work

15:31

but it's not it's not as good and that's unfortunate it's I you know

15:37

because I've never used the stuff pre-regulations but I personally use

15:42

this stuff I love it it tastes phenomenal I think well the cinnamon helps the cinnamon helps human version I

15:49

I you know the garlic and and cayenne but I know personally I don't have heart issues or anything but it's great for

15:54

cardiovascular health but I know a lot of people that it has actually saved their lives well with the post product

16:02

so it's still good but that's that's interesting to hear that it's it was

16:08

basically dumbed down oh it was it was better they made it clear to me it was

16:15

better before they were forced to follow these regulations

16:20

and if you're going to treat them like chemical drugs that part of the regulations and for people that don't

16:27

have that training you can understand the rationale but it's just an example of how and and our

16:34

regulations are not well-intentioned but um you know just how things aren't always how they seem but I'll get back

16:41

to the story so he's charged with practicing medicine without a license he hires me to defend them and I'm looking

16:48

at this and I'm going this is no no hold up hold on so at this point in time so at one point in time you were working on

16:53

behalf of Health Canada yeah trying to take him down now he's hiring you and you're you're moving over from the Dark Side to the light side is that is that

17:00

yeah well and and it's actually the only reason I can talk about the health Canada experience is I had to get their

17:06

permission to waive Celestial client privilege to act for him and they thought it would

17:11

be a good idea because you know maybe I could talk some sense into them and calm them down or whatever

17:17

so that's why I can talk about them saying he was a rogue herbalist and stuff like that is they actually waived

17:23

solicitor client privilege so that I could act for him um

17:28

you know and they would have saw no downside in that I mean he's going to hire a lawyer why not

17:34

this guy that can talk some sense into him and there's always there's always two sides

17:39

to a story and I I learned the other side when I was was acting for Jim

17:46

so I've got a I've got an awful case like on the facts I've got a guy who can't stop talking

17:52

about curing heart disease and the law says he can't do that because he's not a

17:58

doctor so I have to attack the law as being unconstitutional we have freedom of

18:03

expression and section 2B of our chart of Rights and Freedoms um and back then the charter used to

18:08

mean something like you courts would actually follow it back then um pre-covet so um and the law was

18:15

really strong on protecting speech but I had a I had a narrative problem

18:22

and the narrative problem was is if El Canada accept or if the judge accepted

18:27

Health Canada's narrative that here we've got a row curb list selling unapproved treatments

18:34

and especially for heart disease and so actually people could die or you know be

18:40

seriously injured by delaying getting proper treatment then the judge isn't going to want to

18:48

find in my favor even though the law is on our side like that law restricted

18:54

speech case laws on my side but put yourself in the judge's shoe if you choose if you

19:00

think your decision is actually going to lead to death and harm you're really not going to want to make

19:08

that decision even though the law says you should I mean it's just basic psychology

19:15

so I had to make sure the judge didn't accept that narrative much like in the true hope case we had

19:21

to give the judge a different narrative than health Canada was presenting right so same thing

19:27

um so I go to Jim's shop it was called Natural Way herbs it was literally this

19:33

teeny little herb shop that you know told Mom and Pop shop with bottles of herbs everywhere and you

19:41

actually smelled of herbs if you spent any like half an hour there like it's

19:47

just the aroma was everywhere this was a working herbalist shop and uh so I go to a shop and I I'm

19:54

explaining the problem to them and and and saying Jim is there any way we can you know show that you that your heart

20:01

drops work that you're telling the truth like I mean there's not going to be any clinical evidence I know his story

20:07

but it could be a little self-serving right and I guess I need to finish his story so I've explained to your audience

20:14

how he was trained by his grandparents who were Master herbalists with four

20:21

centuries of expertise behind him well he wasn't interested in that at all

20:27

he got a PhD in electrical engineerings and was working for BC Hydro as an

20:32

engineer and he has a heart attack and he's rushed by ambulance to the

20:37

hospital and they do an angiogram and he's got one artery 100 blocked another 80 percent blocked and they tell them

20:45

Jim you need a double bypass surgery if you're going to survive

20:50

and he he didn't like that idea so he checked himself out of the hospital he makes the heart drops

20:56

he treats his heart disease and you know it's interesting he said the difficulty wasn't figuring out how

21:03

to dissolve plaque in your arteries that's the easy part the difficulty is how to do it slowly

21:11

right he says that that's what he had to work on not not how do we clean this out how do we do it slow enough that we're

21:18

not creating any problems right so he he makes us arthrops he treats himself he

21:23

gets well he never has a bypass surgery he lived at least another 30 years and died in that old folk song

21:30

he did not die of heart disease so um and then he decides transformation

21:36

experience I've I've got to sell these so he quits

21:42

his job starts selling these heart drops he sells a whole bunch of other remedies now he's in the now he's in the family

21:48

business and um so I'm there and I I'm talking to Jim

21:53

because I want to is is there some way we can prove you're telling the truth like I know your story and you can tell

21:59

your story but a judge is going to think that's a little self-serving even though it's true and we'll have the angiogram

22:06

and all of that um and he he thinks for a minute and then he goes into the back and he brings

22:12

me out a box and then another box and then another box I all I remember today is it was either three or five like was

22:19

an odd number and these boxes are all filled with letters

22:24

foreign and they're all the same like so literally thousands and

22:29

thousands of letters all saying I had heart disease I took your heart drops I got well God bless

22:35

you like so these are people like think about this he's not asking people to write him letters David

22:42

these are people that just feel compelled to write letters now those letters are pure heresy I cannot answer

22:48

a single one as evidence in court but I can call the authors of those letters

22:55

and I put them on the stand to swear to tell the truth and they then they can tell the truth and that's the highest

23:00

level of evidence in court and so I start phoning these people

23:06

and on the day of trial I had five middle class professional Witnesses and I chose I mean I cherry-picked middle

23:13

class professionals because the judge is a middle class professional so these are the judge's people

23:19

and and for credibility reasons I wanted that they had all had heart disease they had

23:25

all had at least one open heart bypass surgery one at that two they all continued to have heart disease because

23:30

the reasons their arteries were plugging up was not being addressed they all needed another bypass surgery to survive

23:37

two of them were too weak to survive the surgery so the doctor sent them home to die and the other three were not willing

23:44

to go through another surgery just to buy a year or two more of life because it was just that's not going to be

23:50

quality of life I'm basically going to recover from this operation and then die

23:56

so so for them the approved treatments that Health Canada wants to limit everyone to

24:04

is a dead end Essence full stop no ifs but sores the approved treatments

24:12

are distance and and here's where from a legal philosophical perspective this gets interesting

24:18

is if we put ourselves in a situation where we allow the government to say you can

24:24

only take treatments we approve of even though you are a mature consenting

24:30

rational adult and all the approved treatments are a

24:35

death sentence for you this this is where we are in Canada there's something just

24:43

doesn't sit right with me with that proposition I mean even before

24:48

we get to the point where none of the proof treatments are going to work for you I mean just this idea

24:54

that you cannot choose to treat your body the way you like

24:59

that basically the government has the right to say no only these treatments are available that's a really

25:06

interesting legal position to be in the game Health Canada plays this is

25:12

it's like the war on hard drugs is the idea is is well if we can stamp out

25:17

anyone who's making an unapproved treatment then it doesn't matter that people want

25:22

to access unapproved treatments they can't because we've stamped them out that's the strategy that they take and I

25:29

can tell you it's largely effective it's the form of servitude or slavery really well it it truly is and and our you know

25:37

we can go into it later if you want but I think I need to finish this story um

25:42

that you know our Food and Drug Laws are not there for health they're there to protect intellectual property rights

25:48

which is a financial interest so but back to the Jim Strauss story so so for these five professional middle

25:56

class Witnesses the approved treatments are are a death sentence for them it's a dead end so they're now looking outside

26:03

of the approved treatments they come across these heart drops they all get well

26:09

David at the time of trial they were all working full time they had been disabled

26:14

one of them had been disabled over a decade like we're talking on disability insurance CPP disability these are

26:21

people that have been disabled for years because of their heart disease

26:26

you know walking around with their nitroglycerin and they're working full time at the

26:32

time of trial you can't fake that stuff and so that was kind of my road to Damascus conversion experience whereas

26:39

before when I was working for health Canada against Jim Strauss my belief was the

26:46

danger was allowing mature competent Canadian adults

26:52

the right to choose how they're going to treat themselves and they we certainly can't allow them to to take a treatment

26:59

that Health Canada doesn't approve of because government knows best that was my I totally drank that Kool-Aid I fully

27:07

believed it and and the majority of well a large number of Canadians would buy that narrative

27:14

because they have not taken the time to sit down and think it through or they have not been in the position themselves

27:20

or somebody close to them where they approved treatments were a death sentence

27:25

and then they discover an unapproved treatment that that saves their life or transforms their standard of living

27:32

um those people they don't buy this narrative at all but but

27:38

it's a rational narrative if you don't understand the problems but after I

27:44

prepared for that trial the the truth was

27:50

that that unapproved treatment that single Natural Health product the danger

27:55

wasn't leaving it on the market the danger was taking it off the market

28:01

and at that time I could have given you the names addresses and phone numbers of thousands

28:07

thousands of Canadians that were only alive only alive because of that natural we're

28:16

not and the standard of living I mean you go from being disabled to working full-time

28:23

and what percentage of people who go through an experience like that actually

28:28

write you a letter they would only like I mean Lord Lord knows but I mean I've never written a

28:36

letter to a company that's helped me out if we're talking statistically about one in ten

28:42

that's about it yeah so so now Health Canada would tell us

28:47

that that product needs to be taken off the market because it's unapproved

28:52

and that this is for your safety but Health Canada when they're saying something is dangerous meaning a natural

28:59

health product is dangerous and and they're running around like Chicken Little right now the sky's falling the

29:04

sky's falling you're in so much danger we need stricter regulations they never

29:09

do a balanced risk analysis because a balanced risk analysis is you ask the question okay the products on the market

29:16

now what's the risk of us removing the product what's the health consequences there

29:23

versus the healthcare consequence you know what's the risk of leaving it on the market that's a balanced risk

29:29

analysis and if you are looking for good health outcomes that's what you do but Health Canada just takes the presumption

29:36

that if it's not approved it doesn't work and it's and it's dangerous

29:42

okay so question on that if we were to fast forward now um you know eight years seven years

29:48

something like that to 2003 when Health Canada actually the health Canada really

29:55

began to point their their guns at us in 2000 after the first study popped out of the University of Calgary showing that

30:02

the Empire plus was over three times more effective than standard antidepressants right without the side

30:07

effects and so as soon as that study came out they came in they shut down the double blend placebo-controlled trial but a lot

30:13

you know all that type of stuff but then we get to 2003 where Health Canada is so irritated with the fact that my father

30:19

isn't willing to just fold up and move to the states and he continues to supply Canadians these these vitamins and

30:24

minerals that are helping them with mental health and get them off medications that now they come in and they shut things down well

30:31

they've shut it off at the border but they also when when we looked at the paperwork which then correct me if I'm

30:38

wrong my understanding of that because I was playing a different role in Trope at the time and I was you know a fair bit younger but my understanding of that

30:46

paperwork is that Health Canada did in fact identify that there was going to be a crisis by removing the Empower plus

30:54

from the market and as such they were prepared for it and they actually set up that that's not my understanding they

31:01

didn't they never did a balanced risk analysis showing that there would be harm If the

31:06

product was removed now they had a lot of evidence given to them so when they were threatening

31:13

saying you have to stop selling this product you know true hope got psychiatrists and doctors and people

31:20

relying on the Empower plus to right to health Canada so there's this there's this you know

31:26

file of letters from let's just even ignore people pleading for their lives from psychiatrists and doctors saying

31:33

all the approved treatments don't work I had but but my patients alive and doing

31:38

well on Empower plus do not restrict access to this product so Health Canada had that information

31:47

but Health Canada doesn't care about that because it's not this is the point is is it's not about Good Health

31:54

outcomes I mean David the Canadian Mental Health Association

32:00

Ron lash and asked the president of the Alberta Branch was holding press conferences

32:05

every time somebody died because they couldn't get em Power Plus right and

32:11

that that didn't shake them at all they could care less about that and then remember the 1-800 Crisis Line notes I

32:18

mean it's such a funny it's it's a funny and it's a sad story so what happened was and I know you know

32:25

this but your audience doesn't is so there was so much because so many people depended on em Power Plus and it's

32:33

manufactured in the United States and shipped across Canada um but the call center managing people

32:40

and because you can't just take it if you have a serious mental health and you've got to be managed by somebody who knows what's going on that's in Canada

32:46

and it's a Canadian company and so you know you've got to be approved even though you don't I mean the United

32:52

States perfectly legal but you know in Canada oh my gosh we're we've we've got

32:59

to pretend this is a big deal so they start stopping shipments at the border and they're getting so many calls

33:06

to The Minister's office that we know from internal emails that they do a PR thing where they say

33:13

well you know people are concerned about access to empower Plus and there's some angst out there so

33:19

we've set up a 1 800 crisis line with trained professionals so you can

33:25

call this 1 800 crisis line and deal with a trained professional and you know

33:30

the basically make it okay for you that you can't get this product that you rely on for your

33:36

very life or a family member relies on for their very life so but we know from internal emails from

33:43

The Minister's office it had nothing to do with helping people they were getting so many calls they set up this crisis

33:48

line just so that if you call The Minister's office as soon as you said even for our Plus or true if they just hit a button and off you go to this

33:55

crisis line well before the trial started well before the trial started it was clear

34:02

that these trained professionals on this Crisis Line were taking notes

34:08

of the calls because they're referred to in emails and other documents so we had

34:13

asked the crown the prosecuting office will you disclose these notes to us

34:19

because by law they have to disclose anything relevant to us and I mean we're running a necessity defense

34:26

and they don't come and they don't come in at pre-trial conferences like bringing up well we don't have this we

34:31

don't have this the first day of trial and David I know you were there so you remember you know I bring up to the judge

34:38

you know we don't have these documents and the crown oh we're looking for them we're looking for them and uh second day

34:46

same thing and then third day of trial when I bring it up the crown says well the documents are undiscoverable it was

34:53

like a new word in the English language so these documents are undiscoverable

35:00

apparently you know they were in some Deputy Minister's office or something and that person got transferred to

35:05

another department and Lord knows where the documents have gone but after months

35:10

and months of searching we have concluded they're undiscoverable

35:15

now this is day three this is Wednesday morning in Provincial Court in Calgary Alberta

35:22

so it's probably about 9 45 in the morning and the judge goes ballistic

35:29

and makes it very clear that if those documents aren't found soon the trial set for a couple of weeks

35:36

you know so that the judge will entertain a motion to have the case dismissed because of you know lack of

35:43

disclosure well before that day ends the day where

35:49

the crowns explain to the court that these documents were undiscoverable

35:54

um apparently these undiscoverable documents were discovered and you know were being faxed from you know Ottawa to

36:03

the Department of Justice in Edmonton and I was assured that I would get a copy of them delivered to my hotel you

36:11

know probably by about 10 o'clock at night um and

36:16

I forget now how many pages they are David like it

36:22

it's at least a full binder it was over a thousand calls was my understanding and I believe I I remember

36:28

something about a banker's box or whatever this is what I recall I just wanted I don't I don't know I don't

36:35

think it was a full Bankers box but it was it might be 800 Pages or something that that comes to mind we're talking

36:40

but just so your audiences we're talking a substantial number of documents I'm in

36:45

the middle of a trial and I get you know another 800 Pages or something so I just have I have to try to you know between

36:52

you know in the evenings and you're still adjusting I I have to try to find the time to start reading these

36:59

um I couldn't and it wasn't that I couldn't find the time or wasn't willing to step only the

37:05

problem David was is I'd start reading them and then you'd have an emotional reaction and start crying

37:12

because what these were is is people basically calling in and begging for their lives

37:19

um like these were the people especially back then I mean the true clientele they were the people in and out of psych

37:25

wards involuntarily committed to all the approved treatments didn't work on for

37:31

and now they have their lives back and they're not willing to go back and they're literally pleading for their

37:37

lives so you know so we're talking about health Canada again restricting access

37:42

to Natural Health Products well this is another example of a product a single product that you know tens of thousands

37:49

of Canadians are only alive let alone internationally you take down the Canadian company the international

37:55

people lose it also and so but Health Canada didn't care so here

38:02

they have these 1 800 Crisis Line notes they know people are begging for their lives

38:08

they've got all the letters from psychiatrists and doctors saying you can't do this there's press

38:14

conferences being held by the Canadian Mental Health Association every time somebody dies

38:20

and they don't relent because they don't care and

38:25

no I remember the health Canada inspector on the stand so I remember everybody aghast with the

38:32

answer I think it was Miss Jarvis I could be

38:40

wrong it was either Miss Wheelock Senator Jarvis okay so how can inspector understand and I'm

38:47

trying to set her up to force her to answer yes to a question I have you know down the road

38:54

and so I've got a whole bunch of setup questions that I'm expecting a yes for like in my mind these are safe yes yes

39:02

question stands and you know one of them was something like you know as a health Canada inspector you're there to protect

39:08

our health and I'm expecting a yes I hadn't actually learned yet that our drug laws are not there for

39:15

health purposes they're there to protect intellectual property rights like

39:21

it's not obvious it you have to actually be working with regulations for a long period of time

39:28

before you reach that conclusion and I mean I'll just segue you know what the national citizens inquiry there was a

39:35

drug approval expert um Alan castles from the University of Victoria who testified

39:40

and you know he said under oath oh yeah I know these the dark laws are to protect intellectual property rights and

39:47

I mean I almost left the the podium and went and gave him a hug like hey no

39:53

kindred spirit but when you work with it long enough you come to understand this but so I ask you know the self candidate

39:59

inspector you know as Afghan and inspector you're you're there to protect our health and I'm expecting a yes

40:06

and she doesn't give me a yes and uh so you know I keep my poker face

40:11

up there so the judge doesn't know I'm surprised and I keep trying to circle around to get a yes

40:18

and she finally explains under oath the truth that no Health Canada and then you

40:24

know by extension her as an inspector they're not there to protect our health they're there to enforce the Food and

40:30

Drug Act and regulations well of course they are

40:35

we have the Food and Drug Act regulations and they're the government body to enforce the Food and Drug Act

40:41

and regulations they're the police they're not there to protect your health I challenge anyone to read the Food and

40:47

Drug Act and Drug regulations and point out anywhere where it charges Health Canada with good

40:55

health outcomes or protecting our health it's not there they're not even hearts with acting in the public interest

41:01

exactly there's a substantiate what you're saying here I'm going to quickly uh share my screen

41:07

um and Jog your memory as well because there was not just Sandra Jarvis that

41:13

took the stand uh during that that trial oh I I know I know I still remember

41:18

miles well okay so here we go and and we actually have an excerpt of um of the

41:24

transcript and so I'm gonna show that here just to just to show the um the

41:30

viewers today the dangerous mindset of Health Canada and that it has nothing to do with the health of Canadians the way that I put

41:37

it is they're looking out for the health of the bottom line of the pharmaceutical companies plain and simple because when you look at all the facts that seems to

41:43

be the only thing that they're achieving um so I'm going to share the screen here and um

41:49

we need to go right to the bottom here and this this right here that I'm highlighting

41:55

um Can can you see that there yeah yeah right so so the quotations is actually

42:01

yeah so this so this would be a question and I would have asked him yeah so you're asking the question so if

42:06

you were sent a document showing that people were dying because of what health Canada was doing you would just ignore that because it's

42:13

not a policy or directive and Miles bro Sue Health Canada agent one of the agents on on the troll case says yes

42:20

I as in he would literally ignore the fact that people are dying due to his

42:26

actions because he's been instructed to to do something else

42:32

yeah that's a little appalling to me that it's not a little I mean that that should be highlighting

42:39

uh or setting off alarm Bells if every Canadian understood that I

42:45

think Health Canada would cease to exist because there would be such an outcry saying stop restricting our access to

42:52

what we need to live and stop monopolizing the pharmaceutical industry against our will yeah and actually you

42:59

you bring up an important point and I think I think your viewers need to understand what you're really saying is

43:04

so here we had a trial where there was just literally a

43:10

mountain of evidence that Health Canada had before

43:15

and during restricting the product because for there was a a fairly long period of time where they were turning

43:21

shipments away at the border so before they start doing this they have a lot of evidence and from doctors and

43:28

psychiatrists saying this is going to lead to death and we're talking about a vitamin and mineral supplement

43:34

and health Canada saying their crime is it's unapproved so here we go again but this is at a time where you the

43:41

whole Market was unapproved like everything was why are you singling out this product well we know why

43:47

because it was challenging Pharmaceutical um profits could you imagine if if em Power Plus became the mainstream

43:54

treatment for bipolar disorder and major depressive disorder and anxiety well it

43:59

would cost the pharmaceutical companies billions and billions of dollars like it's just it's it is mind-boggling the

44:06

amount of money involved so so that can't be allowed to happen um so but just back to the point is is so

44:14

before the product is restricted by Health Canada there's any sane rational person reading

44:21

all of these letters from psychiatrists and doctors and people who depend on it for their lives or their family members

44:29

it's Crystal Clear wait a second people are going to die here and then you start restricting access

44:35

and you actually get evidence that people are dying and more and more evidence my life's in danger here

44:42

and they don't relent they just press on and on and on it they only change their

44:48

minds because of it came from political pressure the minister of Health was getting to and the government was

44:54

getting too much political pressure and this was at a time the media some of the media was reporting the truth about what

45:00

was happening and it bear that would never happen again an embarrassing Healthcare I won't touch on that real

45:07

quick just to highlight that there was a shift that took place in 2010 when you say that you know that there was some

45:13

media that was actually covering it truthfully my job at that particular time was actually doing video work for

45:18

True open I'd catalog every uh media article that would come out on on true hope or anything related to you know the

45:25

dangers of antidepressants and whatnot not kapala video later on uh on that but anyways in relation to that there was

45:32

something interesting the only media Outlet at that time that wasn't speaking the truth was CBC go figure

45:40

Crown owned organization it's like they lived in a entirely different world what

45:46

they were reporting was at odds with what every other media Outlet was reporting in relation to what was taking

45:53

place in called Canada or CBC just went quiet so when I would log all of this

45:58

video stuff up until 2010 everybody was seeing good stuff about Empire plus every time a study would

46:04

come out you know there'd be some news articles on it in relation to you know autism and this and all sorts of stuff

46:11

right people or people are becoming aware of it because the news was actually reporting it except for CBC now

46:18

something happened at about 2010 where everything began to shift we had these

46:24

you know groundbreaking double blind stable control trial come out on Empire Plus crickets no media Outlets any longer

46:32

after about 2010 were willing to report on that type of stuff and that's when we saw the shift that by the time we get to

46:38

2016 and you're representing myself and my wife in in court proceedings that all

46:43

of the media Outlets were parroting a false narrative if it was shameful it

46:50

was it was shameful so you know and people can read the court transcripts and compare with what the media of the

46:57

day was but I mean the evidence inside the court you know live would be even more compelling

47:03

and and the media would be reporting on like it was pure fiction like it would

47:08

have or or the opposite of the truth like it was so it was so compelling that that it was quite disheartening

47:17

so sorry I want to inject that that that part because you're talking about how the media is at that point in time

47:24

during all this stuff when when it there's all this political pressure that's yeah and I was just trying to

47:31

trying to make the point to hero of Canada's created this impression that

47:36

they're there to protect us I mean just you know segue into a recent example you

47:42

know if we take these covid-19 vaccines for every vaccine that they've approved

47:49

Health Canada has approved they have a separate web page so let's say the let's take the Pfizer one I always use Pfizer

47:55

as an example because I think there's been more Pfizer shots than any other type of shot in Canada if you go to their health

48:01

Canada web page and I I don't even have to look but it's been this way for years and it'll still be this way today

48:08

the first sentence at the top which will be in bold to emphasize it no it won't be in bold

48:14

when it says safe effective and higher highest quality so the sentence will go something like all you know vaccines

48:21

approved of by Health Canada are proven to be safe effective and of the highest quality and safe and effective and

48:27

highest quality will be in bold foreign

48:36

that under a regular drug approval process even though the test is not well

48:42

written um you do have to prove it safe and you do have to prove it's effective

48:48

and then following once you understand the safety profile and you understand the efficacy profile then and only then

48:55

can you do a cost benefit analysis is this a good idea that benefits outweigh the costs

49:01

now you can't do a cost benefit analysis without understanding the safety profile and the the efficacy profile

49:09

Well normally that's the test but for the covid-19 vaccines the

49:16

government basically came out with a different test so they Exempted the kova 19 vaccines

49:22

from having to prove safety and having to prove efficacy in fact the word safety and efficacy aren't even

49:28

mentioned in the test so all you have to do is make an argument that the benefits outweigh the

49:34

risks having regard to the uncertainties you know we're concerning the benefits of

49:40

risks and the Urgent Public Health Emergency presented by covid-19 that's almost a direct quote I can give you a

49:47

direct quote if you wanted so the minister has sufficient evidence to support the conclusion and I'll just stop there

49:54

um if we'll use Pfizer as an example if Pfizer had to prove something to health Canada it would read the minister as

50:01

sufficient evidence to conclude minister of South Canada so if if if the test was

50:07

meant that Pfizer had to prove anything that follows it would read the minister as sufficient evidence to conclude but

50:14

it doesn't say that It's Tricky it says the minister has sufficient evidence to support the conclusion

50:20

so not The Minister's conclusion oh it's very tricky so so basically it means the

50:27

minister has to have sufficient evidence to support the argument because the conclusion um you know is really just

50:33

um where you arrive after after you've been told something so Pfizer has to have the minister

50:40

basically Pfizer has to make the argument so the minister has sufficient evidence to support the conclusion

50:46

that the benefits of the drug outweigh the risks

50:51

having regard to the uncertainties concerning the benefits and risks and the Urgent Public Health Emergency

50:57

presented by Copa 19. the word safety isn't there the word advocacy isn't there so Pfizer

51:03

doesn't have to approve their vaccine safe Pfizer doesn't have to prove their vaccine is effective

51:09

you can't even do it even though there's risk benefit language in there Pfizer

51:14

doesn't have to prove the benefits outweigh the risks if you read the test carefully they just have to be able to

51:19

make the argument the benefits outweigh the risks and in the regular drug approval world if there's any

51:25

uncertainty over safety or efficacy it's not approved but right into this test are the words having regards to the

51:31

uncertainty concerning the safety and efficacy even

51:37

though those things don't have to be proven so the whole thing is a fraud when and when we know from affidavits

51:44

filed in court proceedings that that was the test Pfizer and other vaccines were

51:50

approved under so safety didn't have to be proven efficacy didn't have to be proven and

51:56

they weren't proven okay so in relation to that when somebody says you know and

52:02

I don't want to just get myopic on on the coveted vaccines but in relation to

52:08

you know there's this synonymous nature in the that's developed in people's

52:14

minds that Health Canada has something to do with science right that there's really they're they're they're helping

52:20

to streamline the science and the discoveries that that are backed by science when somebody says I'm with the

52:26

science in relation to other coveted vaccines or we've we've seen this so many times in

52:31

relation to people taking you know psychiatric medications over the years and they're just like no I'm sticking with with what's scientifically backed

52:38

what would you say to that well but and it just follow us on the point I'm trying to make and so when when Health

52:45

Canada has at the top of the Pfizer vaccine page and every other coveted vaccine page all vaccines approved of by

52:51

Health Canada have proven to be safe effective you know in the highest quality that's just pure marketing

52:58

that's just pure propaganda it has nothing to do with truth so how Canada presents itself as you know this Arbiter

53:05

of of Truth or you know for our safety but that's

53:11

for marketing purposes and and so we've we've all got this now trust into Health

53:17

Canada so when the media is is repeating and the government's repeating will follow

53:23

the science follow the science you have to understand

53:28

um well why are they saying that because first of all there's science is all about debate

53:35

science is about disagreement and science is actually about you know discussing things so what do you what do

53:41

you mean follow the science like surely nobody's suggesting the science is settled on a vaccine that has been

53:48

rushed through like no other like surely if ever there's uncertainty it's now

53:53

like we have two neurons going together and Oh wait we're using the new technology we've never used on a large

54:00

scale before which which by the way made it so that these vaccines actually were

54:06

not technically vaccines until they change the definition but now you're confusing things with the facts and some

54:13

ingredients like you know haven't hadn't been used at all and the quality control was atrocious and and everyone knew that

54:19

from the European investigation their their regulatory body and that would have been shared with the FDA in health

54:26

Canada so I mean the quality is just atrocious like no this should not have

54:31

been allowed on the market at all but for you to suggest that the sign the media and government to suggest that

54:36

this the science was settled follow the science like if that's if you don't recognize that as as propaganda

54:43

I don't know what what is but now can I just talk about the term anti-vaxx like

54:48

we have been subjugated to you know messaging for so long that I'm actually shocked at

54:57

how ingrained it is and I'm like looking forward to when I discover things that I still believe are true are not true

55:04

um like I've kind of segued into like now in my mind my understanding is um about basically everything I've been

55:12

taught well I can't accept it it's true I just have to accept it's what I've been taught so it's my Paradigm that I'm

55:18

operating under but but I don't know if anything's true anymore

55:24

um but it's interesting that the national citizens inquiry and for those of you who don't know what it is is

55:29

basically a group of citizens got together and appointed four independent

55:34

Commissioners and marched them literally across Canada where Witnesses you know were sworn in to tell the truth

55:41

questioned by lawyers and then questions by Commissioners much like they would in a court setting 325 Witnesses it was

55:48

just this incredible experience if you haven't watched it go to their website and watch it but I was one of the

55:54

council calling Witnesses and one of the things I didn't expect was is we would have like literally a

56:00

witness on the stand who's like horribly vaccine injured and just basically telling how their life was destroyed or

56:07

a family member's life you know they lost their life or you know totally disabled by a vaccine and then they

56:14

would volunteer but I'm not an anti-vaxxer and then we had another lady I won't identify her who was part of

56:20

this pretty big you know anti-government covet Action Group

56:26

who's you know explaining all these things they did and but you know but our group were not anti-vacs and it made

56:33

like so witness after witness yeah the vaccine destroyed my life or my world or whatever but I'm not Annie vaxx

56:39

it's so ingrained like that term antivax or you know follow the science

56:45

it's like it's so ingrained and what people have

56:51

to understand is is these pejorative terms you know anti-vax conspiracy

56:58

theorists those are created

57:04

to turn your mind off because we're we're hurt animals and the worst thing

57:09

that can happen to us is to be ostracized socially

57:15

in in fact you know more I in my opinion and this is based on National citizens inquiry testimony more people who are

57:21

afraid of taking the covet vaccine who actually took it um I think took it because of social

57:27

pressure rather than if I'm going to lose my job you know where I can't go to a hockey game pressure so much pressure

57:34

so great but the point I'm making is we're social animals and our greatest fear is being ostracized so when the

57:41

government and the media deliberately insert a belief into us that you don't want to be labeled as an anti-vaxxer

57:48

like that's a quack then as soon as anyone even starts going into a narrative that could be

57:55

anti-vaccine do you understand you actually turn your mind off your mind is closed because your mind can be opened

58:02

or closed like we we and you you know when it's happening somebody starts saying something kook and like you're there politely

58:10

listening to them but you're not even listening you're just like oh gosh like how long do I have to like you just want

58:17

to exit that well your mind's closed I remember the first time it happened to me yeah back in it was about 2004 and I

58:25

we got into this discussion there was uh some a group of friends and um there was Colette and I there and and

58:31

we got on the the vaccine topic and as soon as I said anything oppositional the one girl said oh you're one of those

58:37

people as if I I'd already been now I'm ostracized now now whatever I have to

58:43

say has no credibility I've actually been Justified right now an object right

58:49

like one of those the irony is is the joke's on them so you see they've now ostracized you

58:56

that it's you know the conditioning has worked anti-vaxx means is equals Kook so

59:02

you can't be a coup but it's actually hurt them because now they've closed their minds you see if your mind isn't

59:07

closed you and we have this experience daily like we'll have conversations with people but our minds open and we'll go

59:14

oh yeah I know I heard what you said um and you may change your mind or you may not change your mind and you know

59:21

when you change your mind you actually do change your mind you re you rework the neurons and we've all had those

59:26

experiences where we believed something to be true and then learned afterwards it isn't and our mind actually gets

59:32

rewired it actually changes our mind but we get to choose whether we're going to change our mind or not it's actually a

59:39

conscious thing and we we have that experience daily but when the state has has convinced you to close your mind as

59:46

soon as somebody goes it actually hurts you because now you will not listen to new evidence

59:52

and will not have the opportunity to decide whether you find it credible or not like so that the irony David is is

59:59

the joke is on those people that then close their mind it's their mind that's closed if you're my if the government's

1:00:06

closed your mind on a topic you're now controlled on that topic oh you're enslaved you're enslaved in that topic

1:00:12

so so in the area of vaccines the government has basically closed the mind of majority of the population so they're

1:00:18

controlled on that topic those people cannot see another

1:00:23

narrative even if they're going to reject it they've lost they've lost the ability to

1:00:31

actually make the decision because their mind is closed and and that you're a slave you're captured when your mind is

1:00:37

closed on any issue so they've closed our mind on vaccines

1:00:43

they've closed our mind on anything that they label as a conspiracy theory

1:00:51

and they've closed our mind to the possibility that the regulator regulation body Health Canada

1:00:58

is not there for our health right we've got so much propaganda like it's you know it's really like 1984 a more

1:01:06

appropriate term would be death Canada you know like 1984 Ministry of Truth is the propaganda Ministry well I think

1:01:13

that you know Health Canada a more appropriate term would be death Canada um you can't convince me if we disabled

1:01:20

Health Canada today and we went to Tony's pasture and we demolished those buildings

1:01:26

like literally you know set the Demolition and they didn't exist I expect we'd have way better health

1:01:32

outcomes oh 100 yeah you wouldn't have a controlling body

1:01:37

that that's spewing propaganda that to Circle back on this again real quick

1:01:42

you know to touch on the belief that Health Canada is synonymous with science

1:01:48

you know the whole beginning of true hope really began due to that particular

1:01:54

type of issue where my mother ended up getting on Prozac and SSRI medication

1:02:00

and three weeks later she ended up taking her own life and it wouldn't be for another decade

1:02:05

later that the science would actually emerge that was there all along um Health Canada proved that that drug

1:02:12

and yet here was the the actual real science showing that Prozac increases your risk of suicide by two times on

1:02:20

average but then in particular circumstances anywhere uh up to eight to twelve times and so

1:02:27

you know when we look at that back in 1994 when my mother got on that medication she probably thought it's

1:02:34

it's safe and it's probably going to be effective because it's had to go through all of this type of stuff you know it's

1:02:40

it's been approved by by Health Canada um at that time I think it was the

1:02:46

health protection Branch but anyways you know people take uh they

1:02:51

have a sense of security that's allotted to that thinking the science has been uh covered this is going to be good uh it

1:02:59

may not be the best for me but it's going to deal with my particular situation and the benefits outweigh the

1:03:05

risks when in reality that science that showed that it was

1:03:11

actually a dangerous medication wasn't part of that that whole equation

1:03:17

and so Health Canada doesn't have really anything to do with science in fact there's suppressing science because then

1:03:23

we fast forward 10 years and now they're coming and shutting down studies on true hope preventing further evidence from

1:03:31

coming out that's supporting that vitamins and minerals are the most effective uh uh corrective remedy for

1:03:39

um mental health conditions why because it's you're locking in those nutrients hence why you're not producing

1:03:45

neurotransmitters and hormones in abundant form so that you can actually feel good it's simple it's really simple

1:03:50

science but anyways so I just wanted to Circle back on that belief that that got us into the the whole coveted vaccine

1:03:56

all that that Health Canada is not synonymous with science and and like you

1:04:02

said they're not an Arbiter of Truth which truth is I think people would be shocked I mean I

1:04:08

know it's not the purpose of the show but I mean if if we even just talked about the drug approval process I mean

1:04:14

the whole thing is an absolute fraud on the Canadian public like I mean it it's

1:04:20

an absolute fraud I mean I I remember I was it was

1:04:26

actually on a different true case you know cross-examining um

1:04:31

a Hired Gun by Health Canada and this gentleman basically ran a company that

1:04:37

got psychiatric drugs through the drug approval process and he starts complaining

1:04:44

and how hard it is you know because you have to give Health Canada to you know

1:04:49

sizable double-blind clinical trials showing a statistical separation between

1:04:55

the sugar pill and the drug there's this you know magic little formula that we

1:05:00

use statistically and then we pretend that means the drug works it really is a pretend but that's you

1:05:07

know it's an assumption that if there's enough statistical separation in a sizable double-blind clinical trial

1:05:15

that that means the drug works and you know books are written on how you can

1:05:20

structure these trials to get that statistical separation but he's complaining you know I we got to get two

1:05:26

of these to health Canada and out of the gate my company we run eight on a new antidepressant we just

1:05:33

run eight sizable double-blind clinical trials to get the two

1:05:39

okay I mean this is under oath and the the person's literally complaining yeah we've got to run eight

1:05:45

to get the two and then we give the two to health Canada now you tell me that's not a

1:05:51

fraud now if you want a drug approval process for chemical drugs that actually

1:05:57

Were Meant to protect the public and have good health outcomes the the pharmaceutical company doesn't

1:06:05

get to run design and run the clinical trial they come to the regulatory body or some other public body set up for

1:06:12

that purpose they pay them money a study design is published for public

1:06:17

comments before the study is run and then you know two groups separate groups

1:06:23

are contracted to run the same study and we'll see what the results are now that'll never happen because so few

1:06:30

drugs would get through the drug approval process because they would fail to meet that magical statistical

1:06:37

separation with the sugar pill well now what now that I've said that your your audience will go well yeah

1:06:43

that's actually Common Sense have somebody not without a financial interest design and publish the study

1:06:51

design before it's done so people can comment on it and then have two separate groups run

1:06:58

the study and publish the results and then we'd actually have true results on

1:07:04

a study that wasn't gained so well and it's so simple to do in health Canada knows we'd have better

1:07:10

outcomes if we did this like any drug approval expert or scientist would know

1:07:16

we're going to get more realistic data if we have somebody other than the person with a financial interest design

1:07:22

the trial and let's do publish this the trial design so anyone can comment on it

1:07:29

and then have have you know somebody else run the trials that have no Financial connection

1:07:36

it's not like they're going to get another referral from you know Pfizer if they give the results that Pfizer wants

1:07:42

like the whole thing's the conflict of interest we're talking about public health with the most dangerous risk

1:07:48

factors facing Canadians or the modern Western World altogether is chemical pharmaceutical drugs that's our largest

1:07:54

risk factor and we've designed our drug approval process in a way that's a total fraud and isn't designed for good health

1:08:01

outcomes yeah full stop yep so

1:08:07

yeah we we definitely digress but we really

1:08:12

established there that Health Canada does not have the health of Canadians at interest but it's not their job right

1:08:19

they just for marketing purposes they're it's their decisions we stomach and

1:08:25

actually support I mean do you know like they're in Ontario this

1:08:32

so there's a case CG versus JH it's a it's a family law case where you know

1:08:40

during covet one of the parents wanted to get the child vaccinated and the other parent didn't and so it ends up in

1:08:46

family court and as the trial court level I'm you know so the the father

1:08:51

wanted to get the child vaccinated and he's basically you know submitting Health Canada documents and public

1:08:57

health type agency documents saying it's safe and effective and the

1:09:03

mother is presenting you know evidence like from Dr Malone and McCullough and people like that say no no there's a

1:09:09

concern here and the trial judge basically you know said well I'm not going to just accept

1:09:16

the government narrative like I need more proof either way so I you know I don't know and I'm not I'm not ordering

1:09:22

the child to be vaccinated well it goes in a terror court of appeal and the Ontario Court of Appeal

1:09:28

literally says that you know courts can take judicial notice and so this will be binding on

1:09:35

you know all Ontario Family Court judges well the court can take judicial notice that if Health Canada has approved a

1:09:43

vaccine which you know you can just segue any treatment that that's Prima Facey evidence that

1:09:50

it's been proven to be safe and effective now and and so basically there's a direction I read that case as

1:09:57

a direction to the lower courts that the person the the parent wanting vaccination there's there's now a legal

1:10:04

presumption if it's been approved by Health Canada that it's a safe and effective and it's on the other party

1:10:10

then to bring evidence to disprove that legal presumption which is quite

1:10:16

fantastic when you think about it and um and so the Ontario Court of Appeal it's

1:10:21

funny like you and I if we have a mistake on law there's no there's no excuse for us I mean we can go to jail

1:10:27

we can be successfully sued whatever like mistake of law is no defense well here you got the interior court of

1:10:32

appeal did they not know that that these vaccines weren't approved under a test requiring safety and efficacy and that

1:10:39

wasn't proven like it's like they don't know what what happened and then I wonder well can another parent can the

1:10:46

other parent that doesn't want vaccine like there's legal presumption because Health Canada disapproved it can they like show well yeah but this country

1:10:53

doesn't allow it their regulatory body says no not for kids this country doesn't allow it they're in regulatory

1:10:59

body says no for kids oh they used to let it for kids but they backtrack now like is that evidence going to be

1:11:04

accepted like other countries I I mean I don't know but it's it's quite fantastic

1:11:12

how we've so accepted this theme that Health Canada is there to protect our

1:11:17

health it's not fantastic in a good way either no no I'm I'm not meaning that I'm just

1:11:26

so shocked but it's just most people don't ever look into this stuff right

1:11:31

and if you don't look into it you have no understanding that that it's like The Wizard of Oz and there's a curtain

1:11:39

separating you from the truth and the truth is so very different from

1:11:44

what you see presented to you absolutely absolutely yeah and may we

1:11:50

all find ourselves shaking our own paradigms so that we can free ourselves from the shackle of delusional beliefs

1:11:56

that have been instilled in us from the time that we were in our youth if we're

1:12:01

talking Health Canada right now um there's been a lot of Rumblings over the last number of months in relation to

1:12:08

what they're doing with the Natural Health industry now um and you've been heading up you've been really spearheading

1:12:15

um an action plan and identifying all of the issues whereas I see it you know a

1:12:21

number of movements out there are really myopic where they're looking at one particular issue to the exclusion of the

1:12:26

others and and they're actually missing uh some of the most alarming elements of

1:12:32

what health Canada is currently doing and what we have on the horizon looking forward down the road if Health Canada

1:12:37

is able to continue to proceed with what they're doing can you highlight what health Canada is doing

1:12:43

um from from the different angles the different approaches it seems like there's more than one Battlefront here okay so first of all I mean I we have we

1:12:51

have to backtrack and give a little bit of historical context so remember I've already shared how we were unregulated I

1:13:00

mean we had chemical drug regulations that just were totally inappropriate for natural products

1:13:07

basically by and large were left alone so even

1:13:13

well in the 80s especially in the 80s and

1:13:19

then the end of the early 90s like natural products are just taken off I mean I I think as a kid I mean

1:13:26

I grew up in the city of a quarter million like was there a health food store in the 70s in that City like

1:13:34

I don't even remember like but you know they by the 80s I mean this is becoming really popular and things

1:13:40

are happening and now both in the United States and in Canada the regulatory bodies are getting concerned

1:13:47

and I don't mean concerned about her health um and so both in the U.S and Canada the

1:13:54

regulatory bodies start trying well they're not trying they drive companies under they drive Products off the market

1:14:00

saying you have to comply with the chemical drug regulations because the word drug is defined so

1:14:07

broadly is to conclude anything used for therapeutic purpose even though the drug regulations were intended for Dangerous

1:14:12

chemicals they're saying well you have to comply so

1:14:18

both countries there's the citizen Rebellion because people notice products are going off the market they rely on

1:14:23

them for their lives or health they get excited now the U.S there's consumer rebellion was a few years before ours it

1:14:30

was early 90s and it was so large that Congress was actually forced politically to to look into it how should we

1:14:37

regulate natural products they call them dietary supplements but the same things how should we regulate natural products

1:14:44

and Congress actually concluded these products are so safe that they should be deemed by law to be

1:14:51

safe so and we shouldn't treat them as drugs at all we should treat them put them in

1:14:57

the food category so they actually passed an act called the dietary supplement health and Education Act of

1:15:03

1994 where by law Naturals Health products are deemed as

1:15:09

Foods they're classed as foods and by law they're deemed to be safe there's actually illegal presumption that

1:15:16

they're safe and this is after Congress had a really hard look at are they safe or are they not safe

1:15:22

so they've actually put into their law they're deemed they're presumed by law to be safe and the FDA the Food and Drug

1:15:29

Administration that their equivalent of Health Canada is only supposed to take one off the market if they have you know

1:15:35

evidence that that specific product actually does pose a risk

1:15:40

wow okay now when you go to the United States then so all their products are

1:15:46

unapproved because you don't have to get approval do you and I I have to ask I mean do you

1:15:52

feel unsafe when you go to health food store do you feel unsafe if you went to a naturopathic doctor like is there any

1:15:57

problem with their products well we're in the same boat unregulated and we have our consumer

1:16:04

Rebellion it's a few years later ours culminates in 1998 or 97.

1:16:11

so the consumer Rebellion is so large that the health Minister Alan Rock publicly

1:16:18

backs down the day before a lawsuit on cost recovery and says I'm going to ask the standing

1:16:24

committee of Health to have a really serious look how should we regulate these products and so the stand

1:16:30

committee Health it's an it's a a committee in Parliament that's supposed to have expertise in health issues and

1:16:37

it's made up from MPS of all parties and it holds the broadest consultations

1:16:43

in Canadian history for any standing committee at the time I don't know if that's been surpassed since I doubt it

1:16:51

and they basically say Canadians want increased access you do not regulate these as chemical

1:16:59

drugs that's totally inappropriate and let's not pretend these are risky like help me out here and we all agree you

1:17:05

know let's not be fraudulent let's not adulterate but we've got those protections both in the Food and Drug

1:17:10

Act we don't need regulations for that it's right in the ACT fraud we're also protected in our criminal code and

1:17:15

Telecommunications Act and we'd also you can be charged on the criminal code if you adulterate a product and hurt

1:17:21

somebody I mean so we've got lots of legal protection there that's not what we're talking

1:17:26

about so Health Canada doesn't didn't like those

1:17:32

they came up with 53 recommendations I they're still terrible recommendations you ask you ask MPS whose only tool is

1:17:40

is to pass laws you know either Acts or regulations and they're going to say the solutions regulations but they're seeing

1:17:46

don't treat them as drugs and it has to be structured so Canadians have increased access seeing if you over

1:17:53

regulate you have just decreased access right well Canada didn't like this it's actually this report came out in 98. it

1:18:01

took six years to get drug style regulations because they actually came up with this transition team well how do

1:18:06

we come up with a regulatory scheme to honor what the standing committee itself said well this transition team said the wrong

1:18:13

thing they didn't say came like a drug model so Health Canada had to kind of ignore that and wait a little while and

1:18:19

then appoint another transition team that then gave them what they want wanted which was you know a

1:18:24

recommendation for a chemical drug style models so we got halfway into a chemical

1:18:30

drug style model so remember in the United States their classless Foods were classless

1:18:36

drugs in the United States they're deemed by law to be safe well we're deemed by law

1:18:43

to be unsafe and uneffective so in the United States you don't have

1:18:48

to get approval you basically submit a letter to the FDA announcing that you're going to start

1:18:54

selling this product and here's the claim and if they don't object Bob's your uncle and off you go

1:19:00

whoa but that's because they're Foods in Canada were drugs so we're deemed to be unsafe we're

1:19:07

deemed to be ineffective you can't sell anything for a therapeutic product that isn't approved only we're now approved

1:19:13

unapproved problem so you have to apply for a license to get permission and the license can be

1:19:20

refused for any reason that has nothing to do with safety and so we went halfway into the drug

1:19:27

model I say halfway because this the the carrot was the thing that allowed this

1:19:33

to become tolerable to the industry was that we could use traditional use

1:19:39

evidence to get through the efficacy hurdle now having to prove safety has just

1:19:46

added to the cost and and there's been some ridiculous things my favorite is my

1:19:52

favorite story is nature Sunshine um and you know I don't want to alarm people

1:19:57

um because it's actually quite a scary story dealing with safety but you know

1:20:02

parsley that you can go into the you know produce section of any grocery store and buy and eat and parsley

1:20:09

actually has some therapeutic purposes and health Canada agrees with that so

1:20:16

um nature Sunshine had this brilliant idea well why don't we help people by drying the parsley

1:20:22

grinding it up into a fine powder and encapsulating it and then selling it for

1:20:27

a therapeutic purpose it's easy to dose because of how we've put it into capsules where you know the exact amount

1:20:35

um and well they were able to convince South Canada that parsley you know has

1:20:42

the therapeutic effect that it would be sold for but they couldn't convince

1:20:47

Health Canada that Parsley was safe because David don't you know you can you can search all you want and you're not

1:20:54

going to find any safety studies on parsley so now it's a it's a funny story and

1:21:01

they eventually embarrassed Health Canada into relenting and didn't have to come up with safety studies

1:21:08

but it adds to the cost because we actually for every product on the Shelf when there's never been a death that we

1:21:14

can point to in Canadian history caused by natural product because these are ingredients in our

1:21:20

food supply and you know in the case of vitamins and minerals these are actually things we need to stay healthy now because our Foods no longer have the

1:21:28

vitamins and minerals because of our modern farming practices that they used to have so

1:21:33

okay safety isn't an issue but we have to prove safety for every product which

1:21:40

just adds to the cost and then we have to prove efficacy but we can use traditional use evidence for

1:21:47

efficacy and like you know I remember I was telling you about Jim Strauss like his family had been traditional healers

1:21:53

for four centuries but you know a lot of those things like you know they've been used for thousands of years

1:22:02

and we can use that evidence to justify efficacy and that allowed us

1:22:09

to go halfway into the drug model and tolerate it we've lost lots of products

1:22:16

have become less effective they're dumbed down and what I mean by that is is to get a license product after

1:22:22

product Health Canada said you have to drop this ingredient or you have to drop the levels to this amount and I had

1:22:29

manufacturers coming to me when we were doing this transition scene you know we can only get a license for some of our

1:22:36

best sellers and their best sellers because they're effective but basically we're having to dumb the

1:22:43

products down so where they won't work and we're gonna we're refusing we're not going to sell products that don't work

1:22:48

but not all manufacturers did that so you know if you didn't have a naturopathic doctor or somebody telling

1:22:54

you you got to go eight times the label dosage amount for this to work it's totally useless well it's exactly

1:23:01

taking a thousand IU of vitamin D A Day following the label claim in wintertime why are you even bothering even though

1:23:08

you're dead in desperate need of vitamin D you're not getting enough for it to be meaningful that's part of the game so

1:23:16

but we we got ourselves halfway into the drug model and remember it took out

1:23:21

Canada six years because the transition first transition team wasn't going to support this but they're like you know

1:23:27

the Chinese they plan in you know 100 years and thousand years like they got the goal the goal is to get rid of this

1:23:34

these effective products and move us strictly into a chemical drug model and in their latest attempt to get us full

1:23:42

into the chemical drug model is called the self-care framework and they came out with this in 2017 and

1:23:48

they said here's the steps it's non-negotiable and what we're basically going to do is

1:23:55

is we're going to take Natural Health Products and we're going to take the chemical over the counter drugs

1:24:03

and we're going to harmonize so they're regulated exactly the same

1:24:09

so you know in their their rationality is this you know look at somebody wants a pain reliever and they go to the

1:24:15

drugstore and you got aspirin there and right beside it you have white willow bark they're both pain relievers now I'm

1:24:21

deliberately picking that because aspirins from White Willow bar it's just one of one of the ingredients of white

1:24:28

willow bark that treats pain that's the most effective one

1:24:35

they isolated they're isolated and then they tweaked it they made it they

1:24:40

tweaked it so now it's a chemical that we've never had before that's similar to the naturally occurring one bound up

1:24:48

with other things including other ingredients that also mitigate pain but we've got this now we

1:24:54

can patent it and now we can get through this expensive new drug approval process

1:25:00

and yes it actually treats pain it works so even though we've tweaked it it still

1:25:05

works as a pain reliever oh but it causes gastrointestinal bleeding which causes a number of deaths each year and

1:25:11

another of other immunomerative of health issues short of death

1:25:17

um wait will a bark is actually a probably more effective for pain relief

1:25:23

and it doesn't cause the gastrointestinal bleeding and you know and it's funny the British

1:25:30

government did a big study on this because so many people take you know baby aspirin for cardiovascular issues and they get even though it's a low

1:25:36

amount they still have a significant number of these gastrointestinal bleeding when they did a study you know

1:25:42

comparing it with white willowblark has the same therapeutic effect for the cardiovascular issues and no gas no

1:25:47

intestinal bleeding but that these things are ignored because you know doctors aren't well doctors

1:25:54

aren't told about it right so so they're not going to recommend white willow bark over baby aspirin and

1:26:00

and they have good reason to recommend baby aspirin in these cases like I'm not faulting them Port they just don't know

1:26:06

but the point is South Canada would say well you've got aspirin it's strictly regulated as a chemical drug

1:26:11

and you got white willow bark and it doesn't have the same strict regulations and that is unfair to the consumer

1:26:18

because they just assume that they both have the same strict high standards so we need to in we need to harmonize white

1:26:26

willow bark we need to bring them up to the chemical drug standards of proof of safety and proof of efficacy that's

1:26:33

there this is the argument they're using and so the self-care framework what

1:26:39

they're doing is is right now they're they're negotiating down

1:26:44

um and relaxing the um requirements for the chemical over-the-counter drugs which you know

1:26:51

has groups like The Pharmacists and stuff like that up and arms going no no even though they're over the counter these are like highly dangerous

1:26:58

and you can't rely you should be increasing the regulatory burden not relaxing them but again this isn't about

1:27:04

Good Health outcomes it's actually about streamlining for the chemical drugs so it's easier for them to get in the

1:27:09

market so they're reducing that burden and then the natural products they're going to increase to this new lower

1:27:15

burden for chemical drugs which is still going to be significantly higher than we have now and that we can't comply with

1:27:22

and we're going to lose the right to use traditional use evidence for efficacy claims except for the most

1:27:28

minor conditions like maybe a topical skin cream and that's actually an example so how

1:27:36

many products are going to survive this new regulatory regime

1:27:41

when we lose the right to use traditional use evidence are we going to lose half or we're going to lose three

1:27:47

quarters like I don't even know how many products their efficacy claim is based

1:27:53

on traditional use evidence but it's a large number it's the thing that's allowed us to survive and even how many

1:28:00

monograph products are based on traditional use evidence so that's just one aspect which is going to be a blood

1:28:05

path another aspect is cost recovery so right now most of Health Canada's

1:28:13

budget comes from the fees they charge the chemical drug company so a chemical Drug Company even just to have a a

1:28:19

building where they manufacture they have to pay roughly like about 30 000 per building per year to manufacture if

1:28:28

they're going to label they pay another fee if they're going to Warehouse they pay a separate fee like and this can add up to 50 or 60 Grand per building

1:28:36

um for the right yearly to manufacture or label or Warehouse

1:28:43

they also when they apply for a drug license depending on the drug license fee it can be hundreds of thousands of

1:28:49

dollars or it can be you know ten or twenty thousand dollars if it's just a simple single ingredient over the

1:28:54

counter it depends on the category the complexity for the regulatory body

1:29:00

but Natural Health companies have never had to pay this now remember we shouldn't be in a drug

1:29:05

model anyway we weren't before and we should be like the United States but but another stop that allowed us the

1:29:13

industry to agree to tolerate this was we weren't paying the fees and we could use traditional use evidence

1:29:19

well now they're saying we're going to have to pay the fees and and they're quite clear the goal is

1:29:25

100 harmonization so they've literally you know published in the Canada Gazette we're going to charge you the full fees

1:29:32

now David for political reasons and that it hasn't happened yet but I promise that it will and then when it it does

1:29:38

your audience and go yeah he told us this was going to happen so they they

1:29:44

need to get us to accept cost recovery and how you get us to accept cost

1:29:49

recovery is you publish the notice you're going to oppose the full amount by law they have to have a consultation

1:29:56

period where we can submit our comments and then they're going to come out and say you know we've listened to you these

1:30:03

fees we proposed are totally inappropriate well like we'll we're gonna post like an eighth or a quarter

1:30:08

of the fees we proposed in the industry will go oh yeah we can tolerate that but the problem is now we've accepted cost

1:30:14

recovery and then next year or the year after that when they increase 10 and 20 with

1:30:21

their stated gold have full harmonization I can't get the public excited about oh well they increase the

1:30:26

fees 10 this year like I'm sorry but I can get the public excited about the

1:30:31

concept of cost recovery we can't impose it at all so we can't accept this and we've

1:30:38

defeated it three times already like this is the fourth time round that Health Canada is trying to impose cost

1:30:45

recovery and we can't accept it but it's just another thing and if cost recovery is imposed

1:30:51

um we're going to lose a lot of products because a lot of them are our margins are slim and you'll know that you're in

1:30:57

the industry and we're going to lose products and we're going to lose companies now Health

1:31:02

Canada says well we're going to be collecting like you know a large sum of money with these fees we're going to use

1:31:08

every dime to hire more inspectors to you know where we're imposing stricter

1:31:14

regulations on you so there's going to be new things like even when you apply for a product license we're going to send an inspector to inspect your

1:31:21

product production facilities like what the

1:31:27

the burden on the company is not just having to pay these fees but you know

1:31:33

companies are going to have to hire more staff even just to comply with these new regulations so we're going to lose

1:31:39

companies over that with these new inspectors they're also going to go into the marketplace to censor truthful

1:31:45

health information now that's not how health Canada wears it but we're not talking about fraud we've got protection

1:31:50

against fraud you know under the criminal code under a Telecommunications Act out in our Food and Drug Act we have

1:31:56

three different agencies making sure that nobody lies and that's not what we're talking about what we're talking

1:32:01

about and we can use true up as an example is is when you get a license we're basically limited to structure

1:32:08

function claims so we Empower plus is going to be something like supports mental health and well-being or something right

1:32:15

so Health Canada takes the position that you can only advertise the label claim

1:32:22

you can't say anything else okay so let's go to that real quick here real quick I'm going to interject okay so if

1:32:29

we go to truehopecanada.com as of about two months ago this is what you're going

1:32:34

to find when you go to click on the science tab science and research you know used to be populated by 35 medical

1:32:41

journal Publications that you can go improve and see what Empire plus would help you with and this is what you're

1:32:46

going to find you're going to find a video of me to start off with talking about why you're seeing what you're seeing below

1:32:52

so this is basically you're right so before so just stop before where you

1:32:57

have these these lines through the writing these would have been links to clinical studies in peer-reviewed

1:33:05

research and all of this research was funded by governments none by trujo

1:33:10

and some of these research pieces are published in Blue Chip journals like

1:33:16

Journal of Psychiatry Journal of Child and Adolescent psychopharma ecology am I right about that exactly so we're

1:33:22

talking about 35 published peer-reviewed research

1:33:28

articles that true hope until June 22nd I'll talk about that in

1:33:34

a second you could access on their site but Health Canada would say before

1:33:41

and now no you can't do that true hope you cannot share truthful

1:33:47

government-funded research on your product from not from governments around the world you can't share that with

1:33:54

Canadian public because we want to censor you and limit you to the label claim now this is

1:34:00

another part of the self-care framework um because remember it's full harmonization with the chemical drug

1:34:06

model is before June 22nd the maximum fine

1:34:11

that a natural health Product Company was facing for defying Health Canada you

1:34:17

know in any violation of the Food and Drug actor regulations was five thousand dollars and offense

1:34:24

so you guys knew you were breaking at least in how Canada's mind the law no no

1:34:31

no no no no let's let's go down that road because you have June 22nd I think

1:34:37

we probably published those videos if I take a stab in the dark I think about June 7th um we recorded those videos uh but you

1:34:45

knew it was coming you and and what was oh you didn't know it was coming no no they were just they were just after you

1:34:50

yeah so here's here's the point is that what's interesting is you know we see

1:34:57

all these regulations that came into play January 2004 right the npn regulations you have to get a license a

1:35:03

lot but they didn't do anything with it right in fact there were still products we were still selling products whatever through the pued that type of thing

1:35:10

importing them in and you still can but we were we were doing stuff that was outside of

1:35:16

those regulations and so were the whole industry really it wasn't until I I

1:35:22

didn't notice anything until about 2010 11 12 that actually products from the US that weren't npn disappeared so all of a

1:35:30

sudden I've I'm restricted as to my access of products that I'm using

1:35:35

and so now I'm having to order them and go and drive across the border and pick them up well what's of interest is over

1:35:42

the past number of months so I think it's about October of last year Health Canada reached out to us and said hey

1:35:48

you know basically here's what's going on your website you need to fix it and we come back and fire back and say what

1:35:54

are you talking about like this is just simplistic truthful information and so we went back and forth bantered and then

1:36:00

finally we said you know what I guess you know let's let's comply because the problem

1:36:06

is is that we have a license and in order to have our product

1:36:11

manufactured in Canada we need a license in order for us to distribute it in Canada we need a license

1:36:18

and so basically they could shut down in one Fell Swoop

1:36:24

um our whole ability to get these products out to people that need them and so we're we were doing uh a risk

1:36:30

assessment a risk assessment and saying what is what's the best way to do this and we said well you know what let's

1:36:35

just show that it's being censored so we did that and then we started okay so you guys didn't know about Bill c-47

1:36:42

your audience is aware so remember I said that you know true Hope was facing

1:36:47

a five thousand dollar per fence fine well they snuck into the budget Bill uh

1:36:53

amendments that as of June 22nd now Natural Health product companies instead of facing a maximum five thousand dollar

1:37:00

per offense fine so using advertising as an example let's say you ran an ad in a

1:37:05

newspaper for a month that you know was an offense because you share truthful

1:37:11

health information that went beyond the label claim like again it has nothing to do with fraud we're talking truthful

1:37:17

health information well you ran the ad for a month so that's an offense that's five thousand

1:37:23

dollars but now as of June 22nd it is 5 million dollars per day every single day

1:37:30

you're in violation and oh you're a company no worries the company's liable for these fines but also every director

1:37:38

officer and employee that in any way participates or the word is acquiesces

1:37:45

what what does that mean actually like you know what's happening and you don't phone Health Canada like

1:37:50

or do Hunger Strike on the courthouse steps like what does that mean but you're personally liable for the

1:37:56

five million dollar per day fine so they pierce the corporate veil and everyone who in any way participates

1:38:02

or acquiesces in the offense is also personally liable so we've gone into the Tyranny zone of

1:38:10

penalties because I don't know of a single Natural Health practitioner you know

1:38:16

naturopathic doctor homeopathic doctor or a natural even the big natural health

1:38:22

product companies that can withstand five million dollar a day fines like Pfizer and all of this these fines used

1:38:28

to only apply to the chemical drug companies that like that's not even pocket change for them

1:38:34

but it it's destructive to any practitioner or natural health Product Company so

1:38:40

David we put fines into Acts to basically make it painful so that you'll

1:38:48

have you know most people comply like but the purpose is is for compliance

1:38:53

it's not to destroy and and the government's supposed to okay well what what's the minimal amount that's

1:38:59

necessary to get you know most people complain you always have those outliers that won't comply like that's just human

1:39:06

nature and we don't really we we can tolerate that so what's the the finds

1:39:11

that you know are necessary to get most people comply they're not meant to destroy when you get to the point where

1:39:18

fines would would destroy where you can't even have a dial you won't even dare have a dialogue with a regulatory

1:39:24

body because you know you got to comply like also on June 22nd Health Canada now

1:39:29

has the power to order any natural product company to basically do anything I mean they could come to True up and

1:39:35

say oh you're all of leaf extract I mean you're you're losing money on it

1:39:41

um but we don't care we want you to run you know a 200 million dollar double-blind clinical trial and we're

1:39:46

making this order well every day you don't do that it's a five million dollar a day fine even if

1:39:52

you say no we'll just pull it off the market it doesn't matter they now have the discretion to order you to do it anyway

1:39:58

foreign like we're in A Brave New World where they can just basically take anyone down

1:40:05

for any reason and we know it's not about health outcomes it's about full compliance with

1:40:12

the Food and Drug Act and regulations and these five million dollar a day fines are timed

1:40:19

because they're basically putting us into an environment where we're going to lose most of our products and it's funny

1:40:25

I'll be on a webinar with practitioners and every single one I will hear you

1:40:30

know through the comments oh yeah well we're just going to set up you know an underground pipeline of illegal products

1:40:36

so that we can still practice you know as a naturopathic doctor for

1:40:41

example and I'm thinking yeah sure you will you would have when it was five thousand dollar in offense fines but all

1:40:47

that's going to happen is is they're going to go after a couple of you groups and they're going to totally destroy you

1:40:52

with these five million dollar fines and then everyone else will stop yeah and further to that I mean there's a lot of

1:40:59

talk about yeah go underground go underground Health Canada has thought this through

1:41:05

and and they've they've they've laid you know they've played their chess pieces over the last 15 years on this and done

1:41:11

so in in a very benign way that nobody saw what was going on but they control

1:41:17

the manufacturers who are we going to get to manufacture our product in Canada

1:41:24

if we don't have a license because they've already cracked down on the manufacturers over the last few

1:41:29

years uh one manufacturer that we were working with got their backside handed to them and actually got shut down for

1:41:36

for a brief time which you know do that for long enough they're bankrupted they got shut down and then

1:41:43

all of a sudden they're playing the role of Health Canada they're they're becoming the policy enforcement agents

1:41:49

saying we can't take on anything else that that could be possibly you know

1:41:54

compromised or whatever or not perfectly in line with npn regulations there's they're they're basically oh yeah

1:42:01

no no they they've got us like we so yeah they've they've totally got us in

1:42:08

their in their crosshairs so um yeah no apps absolutely it's it's

1:42:14

quite frightening so if we're to sum it up basically we've got this egregious enforcement

1:42:21

uh powers that have been granted there's one other thing that I forgot to bring up please

1:42:27

and this is important so what health Canada's made clear is that when we fully transition into

1:42:34

this self-care framework where we're regulated the same as the chemical over-the-counter drugs that if you want

1:42:41

to be licensed under this scheme it's only for things that are truly over-the-counter meaning you know you go

1:42:46

to the drugstore and without talking to anyone you like I want a pain reliever

1:42:52

or I'm constipated you just grab you know you make your own decision it's called self-care but if it's a condition

1:42:59

for which you would seek the advice of a medical practitioner be that a medical doctor or a naturopath

1:43:06

or homeopath or traditional Chinese practitioner or nutritionist we're not licensing under this scheme

1:43:14

for anything that you would seek the advice of a healthcare practitioner you no no for those things you've got to

1:43:20

go through the new drug approval process which you can't get through so

1:43:26

what's going to happen to our natural practitioners our naturopathic doctors and the like when those products can no

1:43:32

longer be licensed the products that they use when people seek their advice

1:43:39

what's going to happen to those products and if those products are gone what's going to happen to those practitioners

1:43:46

and now you know we'll we will find ourselves within a couple of years where

1:43:52

we don't have the option any option other than a chemical

1:43:57

pharmaceutical model and that's how Canada's goal and it's been their goal for you know

1:44:04

the 30 years I've been involved we and we really saw this already in history I mean predating myself and yourself but

1:44:12

we saw where you know naturopathy was was knocked off Homeopathy was knocked off in favor of Rockefeller medicine or

1:44:20

petroleum-based medicine which is you know what we call pharmaceutical medicine today

1:44:25

um and we really saw how in America they had already monopolized and the only

1:44:31

survivors were was actually chiropractors they were the only I guess

1:44:36

what you didn't be alternative they're not alternative I mean it predates uh

1:44:41

pharmaceutical medicine but they were the only ones that were able to keep on going and it hasn't been until you know

1:44:48

basically the last 40 years that we saw naturopathy starting to rise up and Homeopathy starting to rise up it was

1:44:53

kind of resurrected but you know there was basically almost a whole generation that went without having access to that and so we already

1:45:01

see where where they're looking at going and that they're they're trying to really Corral Us in and control it and

1:45:07

and basically knock this this whole industry right into Oblivion so that

1:45:12

it's not accessible and it's not just the federal government like I mean you look at BC with their you know their new

1:45:18

bill that kind of gets all the health practitioners under one umbrella I mean

1:45:23

you can't if I understand that bill correctly I mean you first of all you personally have to let's say they take

1:45:30

say you need to be vaccinated to practice I mean they can dictate to you your medical decisions as a right to

1:45:37

practice but you also can't go against the government lying what their narrative is so I mean we basically have the

1:45:43

provinces also restricting you know all practitioners the doctors too ironically

1:45:50

where they they're funneled into this you have to follow whatever the government line and practice directions

1:45:58

are um which is really you are not going to get good health outcomes when you have

1:46:04

um medical professionals who can no longer use their discretion to treat you how they in their opinion which is why

1:46:11

you go to them think is the best treatment course for you where they're actually obligated they'll lose their

1:46:18

right to practice and be severely punished if they deviate from whatever the recommendation is from the

1:46:24

government for your condition I mean this is truly alarming on so many

1:46:30

so here we've been talking about the federal aspect um David can I talk about you know maybe

1:46:36

plugging in with the nhppa and some things that people can do yeah let's get to that uh let's let's just touch on one

1:46:43

more thing real quick and then we'll let's finish off with that if if you don't mind oh yeah I mean I'm enjoying

1:46:49

the conversation so because you you've you've laid out that this is really really concerning and and what we're

1:46:55

seeing within Canada right now you know go to a health food store you're likely going to find a petition uh that they

1:47:01

can have you sign you know as you're checking out but most of the campaigns are focusing

1:47:07

on cost recovery seeing that this cost recovery that they're going to put into place you know in a couple years from now it's going to raise the cost of

1:47:14

products and basically you know some products will disappear from it and the other products will become you know a

1:47:20

little less affordable to you really is really and it's not that that alarming it's not that concerning but yet there

1:47:27

is an extreme um uh not risk but uh there

1:47:35

we've got um we've got war on our doorstep right now this is the end game this is the end

1:47:41

game for natural products you're talking about the Canadian Health Food Association campaign their SOS campaign so um

1:47:50

yeah and so the irony is and and I think I think that um the Canadian Health Food

1:47:57

Association is either controlled opposition or is just so divided internally

1:48:04

or you know just so doesn't understand the issues because we've seen that in the past where they just don't don't

1:48:09

have the ability internally to analyze things properly or a combination of the above But the irony is is this SOS

1:48:16

campaign and they're actually not asking for cost recovery to be stopped if you look at

1:48:21

their petition and other documents they're asking for it to be mitigated and you remember I talked earlier how we

1:48:27

can't allow cost recovery to come in at all because then they'll just keep once once

1:48:34

we've lost you know they've crossed that bridge we're done we can't go back across that bridge they've already said

1:48:39

you know the goal is full harmonization so what the Canadian Health Food Association will do when Health Canada

1:48:45

comes out after the consultation period and says oh we're not going to impose full fees we're going to oppose an

1:48:51

eighth of the fees we proposed this Canadian Health Food Association will say see we were at the table we

1:48:58

negotiated them down everything's fine nothing to see here to hear citizen move along and meanwhile the fraud just got

1:49:05

placed in the pot even though it's not hot yet exactly oh yeah no it's the end it's but

1:49:11

so they're not asking for cost recovery to be stopped which kind of begs the question well why like you can go to any

1:49:17

political strategist and they'll say what I said like I can get the Canadian public upset about the concept of cost

1:49:25

recovery but I can't get if it gets in and they increase the fees 10 percent

1:49:30

I I can't get consumers writing letters and putting pressure on the government over that help me out we're done

1:49:37

they're not asking for these five million dollar day fines and new powers to be repealed

1:49:43

repealed they're they're not asking for the self-care framework to be stopped oh well let's just mitigate and soften

1:49:50

how we implement it what you're okay with losing traditionally use evidence this is the end of the industry can you

1:49:58

not see the end goal like are you but remember the Canadian Health Food Association they supported this halfway

1:50:05

move into the drug model I opposed it every other group opposed it but they

1:50:11

they said no no this is great now remember I don't know if it's still the case but they used to get funded by

1:50:17

Health Canada well yeah it was discovered that they received I believe was three quarters of a million dollars through an arms length organization from

1:50:23

Health Canada through the back door and when we went public with that

1:50:29

um if I'm recalling everything properly I think that was 2008 that that came out

1:50:35

they'll see 51 fight because we have to talk about them sabotaging that campaign

1:50:40

but coming out with amends yeah exactly so so yeah so you you alerted us to the

1:50:45

the issues there with Bill c51 is my recollection and um and as soon as we were alerted to it

1:50:51

we're like What do we do I remember being at true hope till four in the morning uh in in a collaborative meeting

1:50:56

with with everybody that uh that had the ability to to play a role in it and

1:51:03

um we came up with the stop c-51 campaign and then all of a sudden we see the stuff being well and everyone adopted that branding so it was the stop

1:51:10

sign red stop sign let's stop Bill c-51 and that became the brand because we met

1:51:17

back then it was probably about 50 Freedom groups that you know formed and and that became the lead campaign so you

1:51:23

guys designed it and that kind of became The Branding and then what the Canadian

1:51:29

Health Food Association did was they came out with the same stop sign and said amend not stop amend health food

1:51:37

stores and they they actually created a lot of division where health food stores were angry with us because we were

1:51:42

taking the wrong approach and that's happening again today with our campaign so I actually had to write it so I'm

1:51:49

part of a group called The Natural Health product Protection Association the websites

1:51:55

nhppa.org well if you dig back I I would I had to write a discussion paper about

1:52:01

their amend campaign and it basically asked the question like chfa what part

1:52:06

of Bill c-51 is okay like why wouldn't you want to stop this whole thing like so are you okay with the higher fines is

1:52:13

that like that's okay it's the other parts you don't like like you're okay with them basically having the powers to

1:52:18

order natural product companies to do anything and bankrupt them and like what what

1:52:24

part are you okay with and so here we're reliving this where this is the end the self-care framework is the end it's the

1:52:31

end game and they're saying well let's amend it let's soften it it's okay it's okay

1:52:39

let's just soften it well what part of it is okay the whole thing's a train

1:52:44

wreck the whole thing's going to lead to loss of products it's going to lead to death and it's going to lead to

1:52:49

suffering and dramatic price increases until we actually lose the whole industry and I will have multivitamins

1:52:57

on the Shelf you know with label amounts that are meaningless yeah you know you still be

1:53:04

able to get your vitamin d and vitamin C for political reasons they can't take that away

1:53:09

but it will not be therapeutic it will not be therapeutic we've already played that game with them we've had to fight

1:53:15

tooth and nail just to have Empower Plus available in a form that's that that is therapeutic but I I know there's people

1:53:22

out there that are recommending off label dosing just to make sure people are getting the benefits that they need especially when they have mental health

1:53:28

conditions now in light of all of this going on um

1:53:34

why from from your perspective why do you think some of the Natural Health

1:53:40

companies are not weighing in on these issues currently

1:53:45

I I think the biggest problem is um lack of understanding

1:53:51

so because we really don't have the word out yet as to what's really going on and

1:53:57

so if if if you don't understand the law and and

1:54:03

have the ability to analyze it in-house and you're relying on the Canadian Health Food Association which you know

1:54:09

you're a member of because they're that trade Association that runs trade shows and the like

1:54:15

um you just don't know like you don't know so I think I think a large part of it is

1:54:22

you don't know and then you know they're running this campaign meaning they the Canadian Health Food Association were if

1:54:28

they were 100 successful on their campaign we still lose all our products like I call that a trojan horse campaign

1:54:35

it's like so you're diverting resources like people might send in one of their postcards or you know sign their

1:54:42

petition and then they're not going to do our postcards and our petition and we're actually saying you need to be

1:54:47

more involved than that no no I've already done my thing well you've supported a campaign where we still lose

1:54:52

all our products like so do you see the danger there right so I I

1:54:58

just find it ironic like I mean they're not actually asking to stop a single thing let's just mitigate in some areas

1:55:06

they're not touching at all like the you know traditional u7's loss of or these five million dollar day fines and new

1:55:12

penalties they're not going after that at all like in what part of that is good for the industry so I mean

1:55:19

we'll just speculate for their reasons why but it's just it's frightening to me that I've been in this for 30 years and

1:55:26

they've been on the wrong side of every issue every time like a hundred percent every time

1:55:32

like where they're our biggest hurdle in trying to protect the Canadian public and the industry that the chfa

1:55:39

represents yep and we actually have to work around them to undo the damage that

1:55:45

they do to protect their members like I it's truly ironic David that you know

1:55:52

when their members don't support us financially so here you know we're often working for free

1:56:00

um and busting our butts to to protect people that you know are not but it's

1:56:06

the Canadian public that we're really concerned with but I just find it ironic no that uh you know that

1:56:13

that we have to work around the trade Association that that long ago used to

1:56:18

do its job but doesn't anymore so in in relation to that I think

1:56:24

there's also another aspect to this um in that the Natural Health Community

1:56:31

has largely been hijacked over over the last decade so when I was

1:56:37

you know first starting to really do a lot of traveling um about a year into it is when the

1:56:42

concerns started to rise I'd go to these health food stores I'd consult with the owners and whatnot get our products in

1:56:48

there and there was this trend that was beginning and what it was is that a lot

1:56:53

of the companies were beginning to sell out to big big Pharma or big chemical or just big groups like it I think

1:57:01

nature Sunshine was bought by the Patterson group in BC for example one that comes to mind so I mean that's not

1:57:07

a Pharma company or a chemical company but it's a big you know commercial conglomerate that isn't going to be

1:57:15

minded to you know oh just wait a second it's this government action good for People's Health or not like it won't

1:57:22

even be on the radar so oh yeah the industry's changed David like when I

1:57:27

when I got into this you know so first of all acting for Jim Strauss and then you know true Hope's another example

1:57:33

like where I bet you for the first 10 to 12 years and like for most of my

1:57:40

career on average half of my law practice has been dealing with natural health product companies

1:57:46

running interference with health Canada um I mentioned for the first 12 years

1:57:51

almost 100 of my clients either solved a serious health condition

1:57:57

that they had personally or you know solved a you know serious health

1:58:03

condition for a close family member um when all the approved chemical drugs didn't work and that was so

1:58:10

transformative that they got into the business of manufacturing

1:58:15

to help other Canadians because it was so transformative

1:58:21

and then when Health Canada comes along and is trying to shut them down like

1:58:27

they're emotionally in a wreck like no one but I'm trying to help people and they are helping people and they

1:58:32

understand the health the health risk is you know Health Canada being successful and stopping them but that's no longer

1:58:39

the case like that's not the makeup that that used to be the majority of the

1:58:44

manufacturers and they they would be passionate about natural health and now we have a hope I mean some of the large

1:58:50

players are owned by pharmaceutical companies right and I'm actually watching the the sellout of stores as

1:58:56

well where a lot of the the stores are selling out to big conglomerates and and

1:59:01

they become very corporate and the mission and the passion that they once had for Natural Health

1:59:06

um and and any any semblance of standing for something um dissipates it becomes cents in

1:59:12

dollars and and so there's definitely a shift that's taking place at that as largely

1:59:19

compromised I believe the Integrity of the Natural Health Community that is laying kind of the groundwork for

1:59:27

really the dissemination of the the Natural Health Community and the

1:59:33

reason being is you know with some of these companies that have boughten up um not smaller Natural Health companies

1:59:38

if the Natural Health companies go to business their other businesses are going to thrive more right

1:59:45

like they're the pharmaceutical arm is going to thrive more so it's not like the whole suffers it's just one finger

1:59:53

of of is kind of cut off at you know while everything else benefits and flourishes

1:59:59

so there's a real issue there they also it's you know now that we've moved

2:00:04

halfway into the chemical model like people I mean those regulations first came in in 2004. now it took us at least

2:00:12

a decade to become largely compliant so I mean I think it's important for your viewers to understand like it's only

2:00:19

very recently that you know products were compliant so like when the government's saying we need regulations

2:00:25

at all let alone stricter regulations I mean what are you talking about like are they dangerous in the United States

2:00:31

no and they weren't dangerous here before like I I arguably they're more dangerous

2:00:37

now and it's the nature of paradox so but the whole

2:00:44

um we've got a whole generation of now manufacturers and Distributors and stores that the norm has been become

2:00:51

this drug model where actually like it's news to them that wait a second this is like this is

2:00:57

like yesterday this happened like yeah you just started in the industry yesterday but it used to be like way

2:01:03

better we had way better products we had innovation like the stress art drops and EM power

2:01:08

plus there's no way you could come out with those today you'd be knocked off the market you know too too quickly now

2:01:16

um and the stores wouldn't carry you know whereas before they would

2:01:21

so so we've you know how many how many Innovative life-saving products have we

2:01:27

not had because of these new regulations when I mean I we could I could just list you product after product that product

2:01:33

before that came in innovative um you know that's really really had

2:01:38

huge impacts and positive impacts so yeah so the cultures change that way too

2:01:45

is now we've got like a generation we've got two generations two and a half Generations in the industry well the

2:01:51

youngest Generation all they know is the chemical drug model like to them that's normal so we we even have that hurdle

2:01:57

like I can't publicly say deregulate I have to say well that's harmonized with the United States and go back to The Way

2:02:02

We Were because it's like it's almost like anti-vaxx is you know deregulate like no

2:02:08

politician can go there right we've been almost 20 years into it 20 years in in six months

2:02:15

yep that's yeah yeah it it it's hard to believe it's been that long yeah but

2:02:21

like I say for the first 10 years we are largely I mean non-compliant because Health

2:02:26

Canada couldn't have couldn't comply let alone the industry there was no enforcement there was no enforcement

2:02:31

auction and the enforcement auction you know the point of you know are having everything censored on our website is to

2:02:38

illustrate like with us bring that up that the enforcement action has actually been increasing over the last year from

2:02:45

what we've seen um in fact I'll share something real quickly here as well

2:02:50

uh that showed up locally right

2:02:55

uh this just happened uh this past March uh Health Canada comes in and seizes uh

2:03:02

these Health products from uh store basically in our backyard

2:03:08

um which I I wasn't aware of Health Canada actually engaging in those enforcement

2:03:13

actions until fairly recent and maybe maybe it has been happening but not that

2:03:20

I'm aware of foreign comes in they see 17 products I'm not

2:03:28

sure if they actually find the company or not but now what we're talking because that was March of this year but

2:03:34

now that now that that test store will not carry those products yep and and

2:03:39

likely they're just products from the United States that the manufacturer has not bothered because the market here is

2:03:45

too small to go through our hoop so they're the perfectly legal in the United States and the store can't sell

2:03:53

them but you and I can import them like this this is the joke right yeah I can import three months of anyone here you

2:03:59

and I can import those 17 products they're perfectly legal in the United States

2:04:05

but you know we need to pay inspectors to go and terrorize the store because we

2:04:11

can't have a Canadian company selling products that U.S companies can sell to Canadians perfectly freely and legally

2:04:17

that that's clearly dangerous I'm being facetious because that store

2:04:23

then will have the expertise to give you advice on how to use those products yeah it's maddening

2:04:30

and now we're now we're into a stage where I mean that happens in March now if that happens post June the story

2:04:37

could be significantly different with Bill c-47 passing that it's not just a

2:04:42

matter of just seizure that store could be put right out of business overnight right oh yeah well and that just means

2:04:47

they will have total compliance like it's funny like

2:04:53

I don't even want to take on new clients now because before like you know

2:04:58

um let me just use naturopathic doctors in this example for whatever reason Health Canada has convinced several

2:05:05

naturopathic colleges and provinces to basically be their censorship arm

2:05:12

um so if Canada come you know publishes these since these censorship guidelines out and and I would be you know so part

2:05:20

of my practice has been running interferences with because naturopathic doctors they advertise quite a bit and

2:05:25

if if they don't advertise saying hey we've got this treatment for this this all truthful

2:05:31

but beyond the label claim so Healthcare oh you can't do that I mean I could

2:05:36

easily run interference for them you know we're Health candidate let's say they're telling you to shut down your website and you hired me I mean I could

2:05:43

run interference for them and and the the level the quality of Inspector has

2:05:49

gone so far down that it's just it's crazy like I mean I

2:05:55

I will have you know them saying well you need to take this medical device off the market

2:06:01

um because we'll look at there's a somewhat similar device by some other manufacturer and they're making Health

2:06:07

claims so this must be a medical device like what like what are you even talking about like it's just

2:06:13

just stuff you would never see before and like you can't

2:06:19

no prosecutor would ever lay a charge because it's just bonehead stupid

2:06:25

um and I very easy to run interference like literally you know on average about three or four ladders before they stop

2:06:31

even writing again because you just make them look silly in your long letters like say oh just wait you're saying this

2:06:37

or what you know but the law is this and this and this and you know but now don't

2:06:42

even want to take on a client because when we're faced let's say I get it wrong or health Canada gets mad and charges them well five thousand dollar

2:06:49

fine but like five million dollars a day and now they're going to be destroyed like I have to say the risk is too high

2:06:56

like I don't want to take new clients because you want to be meaningful and make a difference right and now you're

2:07:03

gambling with so much more on the line well we're in the Tyranny Zone we're in the Tyranny Zone yep so um yeah so it's

2:07:10

just it's absolutely craziness now that brings me to my last point before we get into the the plan of action and and what

2:07:16

you're doing and how you're directing people to to have meaningful action when when we're looking at you know

2:07:24

different stakeholders in the Natural Health Community being silent right and and what the potential motivating

2:07:29

factors are um you know companies selling out that type of thing that they just don't have a vested interest they don't actually

2:07:35

stand for Natural Health per se they're just you know it's a it's a lucrative business for the time being maybe or

2:07:41

it's a sidearm project whatever it is what about you know when we're talking about Bell

2:07:46

c47 we're talking about you know higher risk

2:07:52

are people remaining silent you think due to concerns around Health Canada

2:07:59

uh being alerted to to what they're doing and and wanted to stay off the radar do you think that's a a potential

2:08:06

element as well you know um definitely I like I don't know I I

2:08:12

actually think the majority of companies don't have any idea that this that the fine structures just

2:08:20

changed and that Health Canada now has all these new powers over them right like I I think a lot of companies just

2:08:25

have no idea because they haven't been educated about it but I think part of it could be what you're suggesting

2:08:32

so um like I mean I know it's funny like I mean there were some companies that

2:08:37

were just so Antioch Canada and so understood the long-term trajectory

2:08:42

um that no longer support us because you know they've they've switched over to the dark side where no no we can survive

2:08:49

this and we just need to work with health Canada and be cooperative and like I mean the culture so changed

2:08:58

um yeah like it's uh sometimes I think I'm in an alternate reality with the

2:09:04

position some of the companies are now taking that used to be really understanding and the irony is

2:09:10

this is now the end game like this is what they had feared for years and years and years and and now they're not in the

2:09:16

fight it's quite it's quite spectacular actually I guess the last statement I'd have in

2:09:22

relation to that to the viewers is you know ultimately your your biggest vote is is with your wallet where you're

2:09:29

spending your money um and when we're going through battles like this not only taking the plan of

2:09:34

action that that Sean's gonna lay out be mindful of who you're supporting in in all of it be mindful of who owns the

2:09:42

company the companies that you're purchasing from that you're purchasing their products and that type of thing because we are in treacherous territory

2:09:50

right now and it it does appear that there's just there's a major divide in

2:09:55

the Natural Health um industry and that divide unfortunately if not reconciled or

2:10:04

um if if the it seems like the smaller voices at this point in time are the ones that

2:10:09

that are are ringing truthful and actually getting the information out there but the vast majority seem to be

2:10:15

fairly silent on it be mindful of where where your uh your supplement companies

2:10:20

where they stand in on these issues and whether they're taking a proactive approach because if they're not

2:10:25

um you might want to reconsider voting and supporting with with your dollar somewhere else so with that being said Sean

2:10:33

um what are you doing with an hppa uh what's the plan of action and uh you

2:10:38

know kind of where do we go from here okay so just so your viewers I'll say

2:10:44

the website again the name in the website so they can write it down and hopefully you'll put it on there or

2:10:49

you've got it underneath there anyway so that's the website nhppa.org

2:10:55

um I will tell you that we um we are federally Incorporated non-profit we

2:11:00

incorporated in 2008 and it's curious as so when Health Canada is moving

2:11:06

like Bill c-51 and stuff like that we get funded and then when nothing's happening we get zero funding at all and

2:11:14

go into hibernation um you know where we put out a discussion paper a year and maybe do a

2:11:19

couple of interviews but um literally you know hybrid as much hibernation as we can well

2:11:26

we're just resurrecting ourselves so um we've got some funding now but not enough and we need so you know I will

2:11:33

ask people please donate like please please please but commit to donate monthly because we need to hire a bunch

2:11:39

more staff I'll share with you some of the campaigns we have planned but this is actually a golden

2:11:46

opportunity like we actually should be truly thankful that Health Canada has

2:11:52

tried to take our our natural products away and somebody would go what is he talking about and why is he smiling why

2:11:59

is he actually happy about this um obviously I mean I want to protect our access to natural products and I

2:12:05

believe we can I I actually we're going to win this one but what's different this time and let

2:12:13

me just back up and say the two largest consumer rebellions in my lifetime have been over natural products so 97.98

2:12:21

and 2008 over bill c-51 which actually were these five million dollar fines and these new powers and penalties they just

2:12:28

snuck in again so over 70 percent of Canadians take these and because they're so effective

2:12:35

and in many cases save lives or just give a quality of life that you cannot have otherwise

2:12:41

um people are passionate about this and they'll get mad um but we're further down the line of

2:12:48

international harmonization like David what's going on really is Canada is been negotiating with other Western Nations

2:12:55

for a long time to harmonize the drug regulation and this softening up of the requirements for over-the-counter drugs

2:13:02

is part of that so this is part of international harmonization this is part of you know

2:13:09

um basically us giving our sovereignty away under the World Health Organization I don't know if your viewers are aware of that but

2:13:15

um the treaty that we can't call a treaty uh which Canada is involved in with it as you know a dirty shirt and I

2:13:22

won't go into the changes in the international Health regulations and one Health but you should have somebody on

2:13:28

your show about that um but we're basically putting ourselves in a position

2:13:34

if the World Health Organization declares a pandemic that we lose our

2:13:40

sovereignty we lose the right as a country to dictate how we are going to handle that pandemic and the World

2:13:46

Health Organization can step in and take over if we're not doing exactly what

2:13:52

they want us to do so we actually lose our jurisdiction and

2:13:57

this is all just part of that and you see so if the World Health Organization declares a pandemic and

2:14:05

then dictates that everyone needs a vaccine you're going to have vaccine hesitancy with a percentage of the

2:14:10

population if there's other Alternatives like Natural Health Products to deal with so this is part of moving

2:14:17

us into a position where we're only having one model um now this this move and and we want

2:14:23

we're going to counter this as part of our initiative and the messaging is quite simple and it's really

2:14:29

irresistible because it's common sense is the messaging for that campaign simply going to be

2:14:36

um wait a second do you mean to say Canada doesn't have the expertise to

2:14:41

manage a pandemic because Canadians will go that's crazy of course we have the expertise like we just managed one

2:14:47

in the World Health Organization had just declared monkey pox as a pandemic

2:14:52

and Canada decided we didn't have to react to Monkey pox we didn't have to shut down we didn't have to put any

2:14:58

restrictions on the population it just wasn't a big enough issue

2:15:03

so do you mean to say that that the World Health Organization should have stepped in with monkey pox and dictated

2:15:09

to us that we need to shut down that we need to do this that we need to do that no we actually have the expertise in

2:15:15

Canada to make those decisions and that doesn't mean we can't follow what the World Health Organization recommends we

2:15:21

did with covid but we didn't with monkeypox we could still choose but surely we don't have to give up our

2:15:27

sovereignty and and and that's just common sense and I and that's going to be one of the

2:15:32

planks of the things that we we have to get out of this treaty that that is that we can't call the treaty

2:15:40

but um go to the nhppa.org site um just bear in mind that within the next month it's

2:15:46

going to be completely different because part of what we're doing we have to just redo our site make this easy but we do have a campaign right now to put

2:15:52

pressure on your MPS where we um first of all educate you about what's going on we have a two-page document

2:15:58

that's you know kind of the Reader's Digest and we have a 35 page document written for the industry that really

2:16:04

give you the meat and potatoes we teach you how to meet with your MP because we want you to meet with your MP

2:16:10

meet and we want you to phone Europe and we want you to write letters and we teach you how to do all of that and we even have form letter if you're and

2:16:17

we're just going to have more and more and more so actually watch but please start supporting us financially because

2:16:23

this type of thing doesn't happen in a vacuum and um but David we actually think it's

2:16:29

time now like and why this is such a good thing is so I we can get the Natural Health product Community excited

2:16:35

and they're not even aware of wider Freedom issues like this treaty that isn't a treaty

2:16:40

so we can introduce them to that issue we're not going to introduce them to any other issue other than that because it's

2:16:46

connected but we've got all these Freedom groups that have formed because of the

2:16:53

government overreach during covid and they're actually hungry to see could

2:16:58

we get Parliament responsive again because it's been a huge disappointment and I actually think that this is an

2:17:04

issue where we can get Parliament responsive again and and the freedom groups would be very concerned about this treaty that isn't a treaty with the

2:17:12

World Health Organization so the freedom groups will get involved in this so we're actually going to be

2:17:18

launching so the nhppa will be launching a bunch of campaigns but also launching

2:17:24

a campaign under a brand that isn't the nhppa it's just going to be called my

2:17:29

body my Canada so other groups can join that and run their own campaigns against

2:17:34

these initiatives you just have to agree on the end goals you have to agree on an Ethics statement and you have to agree

2:17:39

that we can correct your messaging if you're like totally wrong right because we there's already messaging out there

2:17:46

that's wrong um but we're also going to start a a bigger initiative I want to to share

2:17:51

because it's safer the more I speak about it um because then it has to happen anyway

2:17:57

whether the current leadership surround or not um we're going to form

2:18:03

local organizations in all 338 Federal writings

2:18:09

and we're going to get people to join all three major parties to control the nomination process and to get their

2:18:17

people to control the policy boards you see because we can win or lose an election whatever

2:18:23

that means because I I notice no difference between any of the major political parties when they're in power

2:18:31

over nobody Reigns Health Canada and once they're elected they're

2:18:37

controlled by the party whip so okay well we need to control the party whip then

2:18:42

oh that was easy wasn't it so we need to take a week the citizen

2:18:48

needs to get the political parties working for the citizen and federally

2:18:55

and provincially so in those provinces that are already organizing provincially and some are

2:19:02

well we need to step in provincially and municipally and School Board level you don't like Story Hour in your

2:19:09

kindergarten class will then take control over the school board it's it's as simple as that what's happened David is is we're in this mess

2:19:17

on many fronts because we were actually tricked into believing

2:19:23

that we didn't have to take personal responsibility for the state of our institutions and

2:19:30

and it was a trick because the reality is is no we're all personally responsible for the state of

2:19:37

our country we're personally responsible for how our politicians act at every level we're personally responsible for

2:19:43

our school board we're personally responsible for our school curriculum and we can go on and on and on but we

2:19:49

were tricked into believing we weren't personally responsible and if we didn't feel like being involved because it's

2:19:55

inconvenient well we just have to put up with a policy or two or a tax or something we didn't like but you know

2:20:02

that's the cost of doing business but that was the LIE David actually we are personally responsible we're going to be

2:20:08

held to account for what we didn't do and what we do do going forward and now

2:20:16

that we're learning just wait a second if we if if we're not personally responsible this

2:20:21

is where we end up and it's getting worse and fortunately people see it's bad and and they're wanting to take personal

2:20:27

responsibility again and so we just have to equip them to do that and and so we're going to do that and

2:20:34

but can you see the resources that are going to be necessary for that project

2:20:40

um I we're not even trying to set up we're going to set up a whole organization to counter the media but

2:20:46

that's got to be down the road because we don't have the resources and we have to focus on some other things first but the mainstream media has become a

2:20:53

weapon against us where they're no longer objective and and and you know

2:20:58

fairly report on two sides but nobody's gone after them to to peacefully hold

2:21:04

them to account yep well yeah and we have to do that we have to basically have a whole structure in

2:21:11

place to counter false narratives and you know and it can all be done

2:21:18

peacefully and it and it can all be done you know let me share with you

2:21:23

um at the national citizens inquiry in in Red Deer one of the witnesses her name

2:21:29

was Regina and she was she's a politically political Refugee from Poland she was

2:21:36

involved in the solidarity movement there from the beginning and actually ended up

2:21:42

being sentenced to three and a half years of prison by a Military Tribunal for handing out materials that went

2:21:49

against the government narrative and she shared it didn't I don't think it came out on the stand but when I was

2:21:55

prepping her for the stand um she said something that has really

2:22:00

gotten me thinking um for a couple of different reasons but what she shared was she said you know we

2:22:06

couldn't get traction we couldn't get public support we couldn't get the

2:22:11

people on the street until the bread ran out

2:22:18

when the bread ran out so you know the strikes disrupted the economy enough that the bread ran out and the

2:22:25

mismanagement I mean which is what caused enough unrest to get that movement going

2:22:32

when the bread ran out then and only then did people take to the streets

2:22:38

well let's not forget the people that was the police state it was a police state for decades and

2:22:46

decades and decades that was a peaceful Revolution

2:22:51

the people of Poland when they took to the streets took control of their country again

2:23:00

peacefully well David they could have done that on

2:23:05

day one of the police state they could have done it in the first decade they could have done it in the second decade

2:23:11

they could have done it in the third decade they could have done it they endured decades and decades and Decades of police state

2:23:17

when at any moment they could have peacefully ended it and

2:23:22

weakened peacefully now get our institutions working for us again and undo what has happened for us

2:23:30

not taking personal responsibility it's our fault we we were lulled into a lie

2:23:37

we see this isn't working and we can take it back and the beauty is is

2:23:44

Health Canada moving to take our way our Natural Health Products is going to wake a whole bunch of people up to be staking

2:23:50

personal responsibility again exactly that's why I'm excited is you know

2:23:57

this has gone on Far Enough as you know fatigue the sum of people in

2:24:03

the Freedom Movement are you're really just getting your second wind

2:24:08

um God is moving in such amazing ways that you know we're we're going to be

2:24:15

able to do this and um and so this is actually the time

2:24:20

for your audience to understand we are in an information War

2:24:26

we were surprised and whenever you're surprised like that you pick any war in history when the one

2:24:33

side is surprised they're they're mowed over for years literally it takes a couple of years for

2:24:40

you to console it I mean a Korean War they literally The Backs were to the ocean it was that dire

2:24:46

you know Churchill gets elected everyone's expecting him to surrender because it was Dire you couldn't win

2:24:54

and then you you consolidate and you start pushing back and you understand that you're going to

2:25:01

win and we're that's where we are we're consolidating and starting we're going to be pushing back very quickly

2:25:08

and that's why this is an exciting time but you have to understand that you can't sit this one out you're a

2:25:15

soldier in an information war and you don't have a job you're a soldier you might have to go and earn a living but

2:25:20

every spare minute of your time needs to be spent on this and whether it's at the school board level

2:25:27

whether it's at the municipal level whether it's provincial or federal or some other institution maybe you're a

2:25:33

professional and your Professional Organization has been taken over and then whatever it is whatever area God

2:25:39

calls you to focus on that is your full-time job as a soldier you can no longer sit still

2:25:48

because you are now being called yep yeah we need to we need to rise up

2:25:54

um you know what I'm getting from what you're saying there especially in relation to the the Polish

2:25:59

um example is you know it's our nature as humans to be reactive rather than

2:26:06

proactive and unfortunately they were reactive to a crisis when they could have been

2:26:12

proactive like you're saying and from day one they could have accidented the police state and and what a blessing

2:26:18

that would have been and yet they didn't do it until it got bad enough that they had no choice but to react so you know

2:26:24

the encouragement is is get proactive even though you're not experiencing the pain of it right now be proactive so

2:26:32

that you can ensure that your children don't have to go through that pain that

2:26:37

you can avoid the pain that will come inevitably if nothing's done about it

2:26:43

and then further to that I can't help but you know take a look at this and you know for some some audiences this is

2:26:50

going to be a very unpopular uh thought process so I'm only going to plant the seed here without getting into too much detail but I can't help but think that a

2:26:56

lot of this is coming about due to the moral landscape that we're finding within the western western Nations I'm not afraid to say

2:27:04

this is a spiritual war oh it's clearly a spiritual war and and what's what's happening though in my estimation is

2:27:11

that it's largely you know what we're seeing is is a product that has has come about due to the moral

2:27:19

landscape that what we have tolerated what we have allowed into our society

2:27:24

and I'm not saying to be you know an intolerable uh bigot but there are some things that uh when we allow it to to to

2:27:32

grab a hold is that there are unintended consequences that are inevitable and so

2:27:38

you know if I go back to Benjamin Franklin George Washington Thomas Jefferson they'll say it in one way or another but the message is clear

2:27:45

that Liberty can only be had amongst virtuous people

2:27:51

and as soon as we we deviate from virtue as soon as we lose our core values

2:27:56

inevitably uh captivity will come about inevitably tyranny will find its way in

2:28:02

and so you know not only to be proactive people but to make sure that our lives

2:28:08

are of such that uh that they're acceptable that that we're living uprightly that we're decent to our

2:28:16

neighbors that we are filled with Integrity those are key elements to

2:28:22

ensuring that we can still have a sense of Liberty if everybody lived that way we wouldn't have tyranny nobody would be

2:28:29

oppressing their neighbor right nobody would be if we followed the second commandment to love our neighbor as

2:28:34

ourselves we would we would not be experiencing any of this exactly exactly and so and

2:28:43

that includes taking responsibility for our institutions taking personal

2:28:49

responsibility that's loving your neighbor yep so um yeah no we've we've been we've

2:28:57

been basically taught to be sheep and not take any personal responsibility and and this is what happens but when I

2:29:05

say it's a spiritual war it's it's funny you know I wasn't serious about God at all pre-covered

2:29:11

and um and then this this starts happening and very early on I form the opinion and

2:29:17

people can disagree with me but I I form the opinion that that you know we were basically being

2:29:23

set up and lied to um and then just the depth of corruption and the depth of control and how

2:29:30

organized this was I mean I I was staring evil in the face mm-hmm

2:29:35

I mean I I'm in Alberta and how many children today are we jabbing

2:29:42

with a product that we know is going to kill and harm and sterilize

2:29:48

no and there's no positive Health justification I actually call it murder I say we're murdering how many children

2:29:55

did we murder in Alberta today and that's evil like and so if evil is real

2:30:04

then then God's real like and then I got real serious about Jesus very quickly

2:30:11

and you know it's funny David like even just any any big public event like the

2:30:16

last Commonwealth Games I mean literally they had people dressed up as slaves pulling out the golden

2:30:24

full of of bail like I mean that that it was pure demon worship I mean the

2:30:30

halftime show at the last um Super Bowl Super Bowl like I mean you

2:30:37

just pick like you will see satanism everywhere

2:30:42

and you know it's I I'm sorry I mean our

2:30:47

male world leaders that go to the Bohemian Grove and go through a ritual in front of the ancient Babylonian

2:30:53

algold God Malik who you know you sacrifice children to

2:31:00

how does that happen like and I mean you can't even make this stuff up

2:31:06

you you cannot make this if this was a novel and we were reading it 20 years ago you just put the novel down and this

2:31:13

this guy's just being so unrealistic I can't even read this novel because it's just too unbelievable only a conspiracy

2:31:20

theorist would read that novel yeah yeah or an anniversary and and so

2:31:27

um so there's something there's something else going on here and and the

2:31:32

reality is is um people have to understand that like it it can sound crazy to you that it's a

2:31:39

spiritual war um it's even funny that we can have this conversation

2:31:45

you know what at the national citizens inquiry I wasn't supposed to be counsel I wasn't supposed to be in front of a

2:31:51

camera I was just the main organizer behind the scenes and we had a whole bunch of counsel drop out so I ended up

2:31:58

being counsel starting at Toronto onwards and um and I was supposed to give

2:32:03

opening statements because I'm the kind of lead counsel there to moderate things

2:32:08

and on the second day that I had to do this in Toronto um I didn't have time to prepare I'm

2:32:15

running Witnesses all day I I was the only Council for day one in Toronto and still had to prepare for Witnesses

2:32:22

the next day but I actually just got this feeling um this and you know what I'm talking

2:32:27

about when I say you get a feeling um the Holy Spirit wanted me to share a

2:32:32

parable in my opening as part of what I was to say and I thought there'd be a huge backlash

2:32:39

like how can you have a secular inquiry and he got Council doing an opening

2:32:45

statement and actually sharing a parable but it was to it was to talk about forgiveness right because the problem is

2:32:52

is the government divided us into camps that didn't exist before between vaxxed and unvaxed

2:32:59

um when really we had the exact same experience like so really the camps were

2:33:04

those who buy the government narrative and those who are skeptical of it but we have to forgive ourselves and but

2:33:11

thereafter I mean it just I just let the Holy Spirit give the openings and

2:33:16

we saw actually that it was positive like people would tune

2:33:22

in just for the openings and then tune out and how does that happen

2:33:27

in Canada where we've been taught to hate God and we've been taught that God doesn't exist

2:33:33

and and what I think is happening is God is just moving so much David

2:33:38

that people understand even if they can't put it into words that something is seriously wrong not just the details

2:33:46

that they see in the news or in you know whatever um but they understand there's something

2:33:52

fundamentally wrong and they're trying to figure out what it is and what we saw with the National citizen inquiry is is

2:33:59

actually even just the message that God is there and that you're not alone like

2:34:04

we're not alone I mean the world's gone crazy but we're the majority of people

2:34:10

that understand that we need to get our institutions back and we're not helpless anymore

2:34:17

and God's moving and we can join alongside of that and get this back and that's the message

2:34:24

right now is God is moving you're not helpless you're not alone

2:34:29

and we'll get this back on track but he's calling you by name

2:34:36

to get involved so may we rise up to our calling well that's that's the whole point that's

2:34:42

that's what he's saying it's time for you to get off your butt and take responsibility for what's going on

2:34:50

and change it it's just it's as simple as that it's no longer you're no longer

2:34:55

allowed to sit sit and not be involved

2:35:01

exactly and you don't want to be you don't want to miss this this is this is too good

2:35:08

yeah and what's beautiful about all that I mean I mean naturally a crisis brings Revival and that's what we've been gone

2:35:14

to see over the last three years is that many people went through crisis which is interesting because for for me there was

2:35:21

no crisis element for me and my family at all um but that's because of where we're at

2:35:27

in life that covid largely didn't affect us

2:35:32

um and previous to that we'd already gone through our own battles and the separation of friends and family had already happened anyways so the covet

2:35:39

debacle didn't change anything there but naturally when we go through the crisis

2:35:46

um we find a sense of of Revival within ourselves that brings us to understand

2:35:52

that there's there's a higher purpose that there's something far grander than than just eeking out in existence on

2:35:58

this Earth plane and so let us rise up to that call and regardless of the outcome the

2:36:05

beautiful thing that I've come to recognize is that when we rise up to our calling is that

2:36:11

we've become some somebody different that we come to enjoy a lot more that we

2:36:18

become refined and that's really that refinement and that that part of the

2:36:24

journey is actually the most rewarding the blessing is that now those you come in contact with that you may have a

2:36:30

greater capacity to bless them as well and maybe you know will be able to get this turned around

2:36:35

if we don't though by rising up to our calling we ourselves still still are the

2:36:41

benefactors of standing and having those character building experiences that we

2:36:47

would have had otherwise so regardless of what you think the outcome may be we

2:36:52

have a duty to take that stand and we are the ones that receive the

2:36:58

benefit for doing so so wherever you know the audience here is sitting

2:37:04

just rise up rise up take a stand and enjoy who you become as you start to

2:37:11

to to speak out with courage and and find who you truly were meant to be

2:37:17

I think that's uh you know there's a lot more complexities to it than that you're going to go through during you know the

2:37:23

process but it is a beautiful experience and become who you need to be

2:37:29

for your children and your grandchildren that they can look up and say you know give honor to this individual

2:37:36

for what they did while they lived on this Earth so I encourage everybody to go to

2:37:44

nhppa.org um see the plan of action there that that Sean has laid out with his team

2:37:52

support them financially become a part of that get involved with

2:37:57

your MPS and let's see what difference we can make here and now and

2:38:05

we will just continue to get the word out there and make sure that you know if if this particular plan doesn't work

2:38:11

that plan B comes into place or plan C and we just continue on and not to throw in the towel prematurely because this is

2:38:18

a very very crucial aspect of what we're going through today

2:38:23

and it makes me think of of the famous words of Patrick Henry Give me liberty or give me death

2:38:30

and the reason why I say that is nobody wants to live in

2:38:36

where this will go if we do nothing so let's take a stand for Liberty today

2:38:41

and that begins here and then take it over

2:38:50

all right thank you for coming on again Sean really appreciate it thanks for having me David always a pleasure yep

2:38:56

I'm glad that you know we we kind of digressed at the end there to to something that we had never planned on

2:39:02

talking about and I'm glad that we did because it's actually touching on the most important elements of all of this

2:39:07

and so I just hope that our audience gets the message and that um if if they haven't yet had those experiences that

2:39:14

are they're starting to you know come in under God that that they begin to do so because that's when life becomes the

2:39:20

most rewarding regardless of the storms that rage around us all right well until next time

2:39:27

um we'll have you on again sometime Sean thank you again when we launched some of these initiatives so um and also I forgot to

2:39:35

say when you go to the nhppa site there's a subscribe tab give us your email address because then when we

2:39:42

um announce initiatives we can email you and also you know subscribe to our social media channels so that we have a

2:39:50

way of of tying you into the different initiatives that we you know we're putting in motion

2:39:58

awesome awesome go visit that site do so before you

2:40:03

forget make it a plan of action and support as you can

2:40:08

um so that we can continue to get the word out there and that um that Sean can continue to make sure that there are

2:40:15

some strong plans of action that that can be taken to revert this because it's

2:40:21

not a it's not a matter of this is a threat that if they get stuff through they've already got it through the

2:40:27

threats at the doorstep the breach is already in the wall we need to to fix that breach and get the enemy out of the

2:40:34

inner sanctum and so action needs to take place don't delay until the point that you no

2:40:42

longer have access to the supplements that you love to take or need to take take action today

2:40:48

thank you very much for watching and yes again Sean well I would say like you know in Canada like we're not it's going

2:40:54

to be another year year and a half but if their things are tightening up at the border so if you rely on products

2:41:02

from the United States that you cannot get in Canada like there's one I'm now

2:41:08

is the time to stock up I mean I just this is like my third order and of a

2:41:13

product you cannot get anywhere in Canada so if you rely on on a product that you can't get in Canada you stock

2:41:20

up now yes an immediate Plan B auction stock up yeah yeah and plan on like paying

2:41:27

attention because like I say we're just getting phased in now um but you know pay attention for when

2:41:35

we're going to start losing them in Canada so that you can stock up I mean you want to put that off as long as possible so you've got the shelf life

2:41:41

but the danger is if you're late to the party you're not getting it because everyone will get the same idea at the

2:41:47

same time right it's kind of like you got to be the guy the day before the bank run yep so um yeah but but you do

2:41:54

have to start watching now awesome awesome great advice thank you again Sean blessings to everybody that's

2:42:00

watching and may we all rise up to our calling and make some serious change in

2:42:06

this country blessings to you all

2:42:12

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