0:00

okay awesome welcome to the show thank you so much for being with us how are you

0:06

of course well yeah thank you so much for taking the time today I've recently finished your book and first of all wow

0:13

you know it's a really incredible story and you also write with such passion and detail and

0:20

fluidity and beauty is really quite a remarkably well written as well as being

0:25

a great story um and you've got a copy of it right there can you can you I listen to it on

0:30

audiobook so I don't have it but if you can show it there you go here can you see it I promise of hope by Orton

0:36

Stringham yeah a really Incredible Book harpercollins put a little subtitle on

0:42

there that takes up half the cover but um that was a bit of sass on their part and I appreciated it at the time when we

0:48

were battling with the Canadian government so they figured they could say whatever they wanted there you go yeah like a bit

0:55

of sass that's great and for those who don't know who you are and who haven't

1:01

read the book can you maybe give us a little bit of like detail about no what it is and what why did you write it yeah

1:07

my name is Autumn Stringham um I'm the second born daughter to Debbie and Tony Stefan

1:15

um my mum was really quite sick and I

1:21

got sicker As I Grew Older um and the book is actually a story about

1:28

um living with a bipolar mom and then ultimately becoming her and then the

1:33

incredible solution that my dad ended up coming up with that ultimately saved my life and

1:39

allowed me to be a happy healthy mom so my story actually ended and began 25

1:47

years ago when life took a really big switch and this is my 25 years away from

1:52

psych meds and so it's a good year to be doing this interview it's my 25th wow 25

1:58

years off all psychiatric medications that's incredible it's an incredible really really life-changing for me I

2:05

genuinely don't think there's a lot of people that can say that no I don't think it's common well it's becoming more common I've seen a lot of

2:12

people over the years who have um transitioned to more natural ways of

2:17

doing things using my dad's formulation using Empower plus and then actually sticking with it and if they can get

2:24

past that first year um with some difficulty usually there's difficulty if they've been heavily

2:30

medicated like I was um if they get past that first year they can they can go the distance and I've

2:36

seen people stick around for 15 20 years I've Got Friends who have been on for 20 years

2:43

right so yeah the book primarily from my perspective anyway you know it's a story of you living with your with your mother

2:51

who is quite ill at the time and your mother's a very very key figure in the book and I find it really interesting

2:56

that whilst reading the book I could really feel that you're on this like constant

3:02

high alert like high stress sympathetic nervous

3:07

system like always kind of like on the go and it seems to me like you're always attempting to try and be aware of like

3:14

which mother you might be interacting with whether it's the I think you say this in your book whether it's the fun mom the dark man the scary or blank mum

3:22

you know you don't you didn't know who would be coming down the stairs do you recall

3:28

that kind of mental conscious awareness you you had to have to be on alert to

3:34

kind of recognize that that different person that might be coming down the stairs and what was that like you know I actually think that's a

3:41

common experience for kids who are growing up in high stress or traumatic situations and I think for children

3:48

consistency is really really important because even small traumas can can feel

3:54

massive to a child um unfortunately my mom's the trauma that we experienced with my mom really

4:01

wasn't minor and so there were times when um

4:06

scary mom showed up and um and the the impact was huge and in life

4:14

um lifelong I think there are still times when I find myself going into that sympathetic nervous system

4:21

um fight or flight and I have to really use some tools and skills that I've

4:26

learned to take myself out and get present again because even as a

4:31

grandmother now you know there are times when you're dealing with little kids or grandkids and and I remember those times

4:39

of being vulnerable and young and not really able to protect myself so

4:44

yeah that kind of stuff lasts for a lifetime yeah certainly in this it's so important

4:50

to have those tips and those tools to be able to like you know utilize quite quickly so that yeah but that's learned

4:57

stuff yeah oh yeah practice for sure yep um yeah so that that kind of idea of

5:03

like you know who you might have to be dependent on who your mother is

5:08

that that kind of constant stressful State you know you're always having to balance which personality to express for

5:15

you dependent on your mother and you know that must have been really exhausting and quite difficult

5:21

for you you know as a young as a young woman as a young person to establish

5:26

your own identity because of that so do you correlate that experience as a young person to any

5:32

like personal identity struggles yes and in fact

5:38

um I was just talking to my dad about this uh I think yesterday we were talking a member of my mum's family has

5:45

passed away and um and so we were just kind of

5:50

um remembering together and talking about some things and and I said you know even after all these years I feel

5:56

like the only emotion for me that is safe to show that doesn't have a full

6:01

body physical reaction with It is anger I can I'm safe in anger so if I'm hurt

6:08

or if I'm sad um I am much safer to come off angry and

6:14

I think that's the only emotion I was allowed to show as a child that wasn't met with mockery right so and I mean

6:21

that's a reflection on how my mom grew up um it's funny because you know they say

6:26

bipolar and mental illness is genetic but I think it's also

6:32

um survivalism in some way and people are surviving their parents so if

6:38

there's chemistry involved yes if there's genetics involved absolutely those things can be passed on but so are

6:44

the um the survival mechanisms and so yeah having to adjust to my mom

6:51

um and not wanting to be mocked uh yeah anger was pretty much the

6:57

safest place to be crying vulnerability too happy sad

7:03

whatever that was never okay yeah I think a spotlight in regards too

7:09

obviously there's genetical factors when it comes to anything that we potentially might inherit but the environment and

7:15

the habits and the survival instincts that we that we also inherit from our you know from our parents absolutely

7:21

play a part in our in our Destinies as as kids and as adults as well yeah

7:27

absolutely you talk through the book about your girl and I really liked how you bought this

7:36

entity to life through throughout the book so maybe you could tell us a little bit about about the girl yeah my girl in

7:43

the back brain um gosh you know

7:48

um I get that it was really weird and um

7:53

eventually it became an invasive mechanism technique survival technique

7:59

but um for all the times that I needed to

8:05

protect myself from big big stuff big trauma big fear

8:12

um having my girl in the back brain was a really big blessing it was a it was a

8:19

welcomed um relief she was a welcome relief so the first time I remember experiencing

8:27

um kind of a part of me apart from myself who was very logical and calming

8:33

and um and I felt protective uh was was when

8:39

shortly after my grandfather's suicide um my mom's dad

8:46

um her teenage brothers came to live with us and um and one of them

8:51

um had a lot of problems and he continued to have problems through his life until he ended up in jail over it but

8:57

um he sort of took out a lot of his uh pain I think

9:03

on me and my sisters and so that was my first experience in

9:09

realizing like I had kind of shattered a little bit with a really terrifying

9:16

um experience with him and uh and then I think my girl became a bit

9:22

of a habit so there were other times with my mom when she was really sick and

9:28

when she felt like we would all be better off dead that was another time when my girl came

9:36

into play um and I think you would see her throughout the book

9:42

just conversations it seemed like the sicker that I got no the older I got and

9:47

particularly after my mother's suicide I'm giving away a lot of the book but

9:53

um in those really big traumatic times I really leaned heavily so

10:00

she she was still a habit for me and still a survival mechanism even after my

10:05

initial recovery as my chemistry started to straighten out but I started getting really uncomfortable

10:11

um with her and sort of realizing this is just me there's a part of me that started

10:17

realizing this is just me and this is silly and uh and then when I started realizing that I I didn't have full

10:24

color memories that everything was kind of black and white and flat I decided to

10:30

be whole and healthy I would need to have that back and so I actually went through a process

10:35

when I was about 27 where I started studying a lot about this

10:41

um kind of incorporation and healing I did a lot of reading and a lot of

10:46

praying a lot of meditating and um and that was the year that I became

10:52

pregnant with my daughter and everything kind of came full circle

10:58

but it was really painful um because I think when you're used to being able to duck out of a super

11:06

stressful situation and feel like it's not your problem and you can kind of dissociate from that

11:11

uh it was uh it was hard to stand

11:17

in one place and experience things holy all by myself yeah anyway that's a long answer sorry

11:24

no that's great because I feel like even just trying for yourself to think back and try and understand your girl and

11:31

obviously you know how how old were you when you can first recall five five I

11:36

mean like you know five years old and you know you're having this internal dialogue isn't there's no way you can

11:42

possibly try and understand that that's actually you know you talking to yourself so as you develop and your girl

11:47

develops and you get older you know I'm sure that understanding completely changes in the relationship with it

11:55

yeah and and really I I've heard it said from other people who have experienced this kind of a yeah survival mechanism

12:03

um it really is a gift on some level like it's I think it's a kindness that it happens

12:08

you know because yeah when you're five how else are you going to deal with a situation like that and if you don't

12:14

feel safe and you can't tell other people what's going on who will you tell right yeah survival mechanism for sure

12:21

like you know you know our bodies and our brains are so incredible and to give you that gift when you you really needed

12:27

it I think that's really important I know a part of my life when

12:33

I I feel like I was living very subconsciously I was just habitually doing things and I wasn't really like my

12:38

brain and my body weren't really communicating and then when I started to practice a little bit more about

12:43

meditation and how I I felt a bit more responsible for my emotional state I

12:48

started to be able to actually you know listen to the internal dialogue that was always there you know kind of that that

12:54

intellectual side of things and it's really profound when you when you know that you've you kind of got

13:01

that ability but I love that that you know it came to you at such a young age when you really needed it

13:07

yeah I think that um the experience I was having with my uncle

13:12

um and you know I look back on photos and I he was like 13. he was still just a chubby face little kid but in my

13:19

little girl mind he was a daunting character and I and I was terrified and

13:26

um and there was a real loss of innocence and all of that too so I feel like yeah I needed to have a little

13:33

split where I could just tuck all of that and say my girl will talk about that later but right now I'm just gonna

13:39

be five okay okay um yeah absolutely

13:45

um let's shift a little bit so when you first started taking um the supplement regime you kind of

13:51

went through like a sleep detox yeah I wish it was a sleep detox it was

13:58

more like a screaming spitting vomiting detox really okay I I just I remember I

14:03

remember reading the the part when you know you're basically being kind of like when you're awake you kind of basically

14:09

being fed these supplements by by a father and your partner and then it seemed to be like you were just like in

14:15

and out of Consciousness and especially like during that time when you're transitioning from you know being on

14:20

these really harsh medications to this this balance and transition period

14:26

um yeah I didn't quite get the the no you're right you're right about that there there was like a week where where

14:32

um I was still heavily medicated like a five drug cocktail and on a massive dose

14:39

of of the mineral concoction and yeah so I was sleeping a lot and

14:46

then when I stopped taking three of the five minutes cold turkey that's when the screaming and vomiting started but that

14:53

was yeah a few days in it was a tough pair at a time yeah yeah

14:59

um you've got some experience with um psychiatric Wards in Canada

15:05

yes what was that experience like

15:11

um so I wanted to be there I was um I didn't want to be sick but when I

15:18

realized that I really wasn't functioning I was feeling like quite a failure and

15:23

then really afraid that my my son might find me dead um

15:29

I I felt like the safest place for me was the hospital so the first time that

15:35

I went in um it was me saying I need to go to the

15:41

hospital and then they realized I needed to be there um I think the second time was a

15:46

different situation where I was I was just having a tantrum in the middle of the night with

15:52

using a belt sander to um redo some of our furnishings and like

15:59

very very very very manic very sick and and I was brought in

16:04

at that point by my husband and I think that there were a few other times as well that that whole

16:10

um period of time is mud for me okay like it I have to go back into my medical

16:17

records and really look at it and that's how I ended up um writing my timeline for my book I had

16:24

to go back through medical records and journals and drawings and things and and put together the dates because

16:30

um it was during that period that I tried 13 different psych medications and I was in and out of the hospital and

16:37

sometimes on an outpatient basis so yeah not a lot of not a lot of memories

16:44

about that but I know that later on I was um terrified when I was no longer

16:50

medicated and I was functioning in the community and raising my kid and staying in my marriage and all of that I

16:57

was terrified that they might find me out and make me go back

17:03

um it wasn't it wasn't pleasant okay I

17:08

um and I I mean this next question I've got for you is and it's kind of loaded and it's kind of and it's a kind of an

17:14

opinion piece for me but correct me if I'm wrong okay okay here goes um when it comes to supporting

17:21

or helping individuals with severe mental pathologies such as bipolar how

17:26

wrong does our conventional system have it

17:34

okay okay I'm not anti-medication I do think that

17:40

if you're going to kill yourself and you really are going to sleep for a few days is a better option and then wake up and

17:47

renegotiate that however that's the extent of the value

17:52

that I see in psychiatric medications I think that it's for

17:57

acute emergency situations and I don't believe that it's the answer

18:03

um to mood liability I just don't I think that if somebody is struggling with rage and

18:10

moodiness and they're all over the map and up and down like that um there's probably triggers real life

18:16

triggers that need to be addressed um trauma that needs to be addressed and

18:22

that's not easy especially if somebody's sick it's not easy so I really think that getting people's

18:29

chemistry straight at the source of the problem

18:35

is a great way to help support someone through healing but medicating and

18:43

sedating and manipulating moods with constant

18:48

meds I just don't think that I've I've never seen it work for anybody just such a short term

18:55

really um kind of narrow way of looking at something you know obviously I think

19:01

you know Convention of medicine is phenomenal when it comes to emergency medicine yeah there's no question about that oh yeah when it comes to chronic

19:08

disease and cons and concerns and issues yeah they're not quite got it right and

19:15

you know you've obviously got a lot of experience with the medication side therapy side the psychiatric Rewards

19:22

so yeah it's and obviously no resources are not always incredible that's it

19:28

right there though you just nailed it it comes down to resources Manpower

19:34

um a patient's willingness to actually do work on it and sometimes you know

19:39

that's determined by Family situations and survival mechanisms so it is a

19:44

complicated thing but I really think large scale um meds are used as patient management

19:50

and not really about healing and maybe maybe doctors need to just realize that

19:56

it's possible to get better that it's actually possible to heal and change

20:02

and if they don't believe that then I guess patient management management is just as good as it gets right yeah I

20:07

just think of the way that our medical professionals are taught around mental

20:13

health and we're kind of another kind of taught about symptoms and medications I think that if

20:19

they had a blank check and they had all the money in the world I still think that with the current way that they're doing this I think they would still

20:25

struggle and probably waste that money I I think it would be it needs to be a whole overhaul of what mental health

20:33

means and to individualize that because obviously everybody's journey and

20:38

circumstances and root cause is going to be different well and when you even just consider

20:45

something like my girl in the back brain some people might consider that to be an illness but

20:51

I think that she was a key to my Wellness yeah like so so giving me a drug to stop

20:58

that conversation may not be the best treatment right

21:04

um addressing the conversation wondering why I'm having it to begin with might have been a better choice

21:09

so yeah I don't know how you could conclude that right away as being like a problem you know like a you know yeah

21:17

you know like rather than like being open to the idea that that might be something that's happening in a positive

21:24

or in a positive way because yeah because given a lot of circumstances the brain and the body don't really make

21:30

mistakes right exactly I think you're right about that okay okay great answer thank you um can

21:38

you tell us about your kind of life experience with health

21:43

Canada we've had um Sean Buckley on the show and he I was lucky enough to meet him

21:50

and we did it in person and a really really amazing fascinating guy really

21:56

smart really smart Chap and we had a really interesting conversation about you know the primary health authority in

22:02

Canada as health Canada and what their main role is um and I'll ask you the same question I

22:07

asked him is like you know do you think that they serve the Canadian public

22:13

oh no oh no no come on of course they don't I no I'd like to think that there could be

22:20

a bureaucratic an elected body that that is uh bribe proof but I just don't

22:28

think that's the case gosh I thought I was going to answer that so nice and delicate and everything but no

22:34

I I think that they are serving excuse me I think that they are serving

22:41

um a completely different purpose and I think

22:48

Money Matters I think Lobby matters I know a Lobby matters and

22:54

um un frankly I think that when I was um a Canadian Living in Canada I was a

23:01

sacrifice they were willing to make like they didn't care if how I was doing

23:07

or if I lived or died it was just a number so my experience was not not positive

23:14

when I went and stood on Parliament Hill with eight other women in the same

23:20

situation as me long-term consumers of a product that was safe and effective and

23:26

having not been medicated for seven years I was pregnant at the time with my third daughter so my fourth child

23:32

and six months pregnant and I get a letter telling me to go back on standard treatment because I can't take

23:39

vitamins and minerals anymore come on that if anybody was interested in the

23:45

health of the Canadian citizen they would have been all over that story and

23:52

begging for more research not shutting it down yeah and I don't know what they're like now I I'm out you know I

23:58

moved to the United States and I live in a state where I can choose a lot of things but um yeah I feel like a lot of people

24:06

who share your opinion in mine and Sean's they actually have a lot more experience with a health Canada rather

24:13

than just you know okay yeah they take care of the health of Canadians so therefore you know

24:18

they're a government entity therefore they must be looking after our best interest you know like obviously yeah yeah that's just unfortunately factually

24:25

not the case when you look at how they run their business so um yeah that's yeah well and I mean

24:31

really I'm and I'm not I'm not bashing the whole system I think every system is broken and every country could do better

24:37

than they're doing but when you consider um that there's a bottom line there too

24:44

right like um and it's it's all about the deal that

24:50

they make with the provider so there are so many Financial factors in there

24:56

and then the fact that it's free means that you don't get to choose they tell

25:02

you what they're going to provide and what you're allowed to use or take and um I don't want anything free from

25:08

anybody if they get to make choices like that for me yeah exactly like you if you get if you

25:14

are speaking and working and researching for the people you have to be engaged with them and

25:21

recognizing what what they're actually going through and you know for a medication to have the

25:27

effect or the positive effect that um Empower plus and the the supplements

25:33

you guys were taking you know that would be a world-class right phenomenon but you know to not

25:39

even consider it because of certain you know kind of back

25:45

backhanded things that's yeah it's just really controversial and you know the revolving door of all those things yeah

25:51

we could talk about that for a long time yeah okay cool yeah so um

25:56

you quote your father in the book a bunch of times and I mean I've met you

26:02

that a bunch of times I love him he's awesome he's a wonderful person and we've we've had him on the show before um and yeah so you quote him and he says

26:09

I've never known such close-minded individuals as doctors scientists are

26:14

the real thinkers so with all your experience with doctors and scientists you know meeting them and

26:20

speaking with them and reading what they've written do you agree with your dad

26:27

yes well I don't I don't think it's a doctor's job to be open-minded I think a doctor is

26:34

trained to memorize symptoms and and drug treatments and clinical practice

26:40

guidelines and to logically unfold what they've been taught but they're not

26:46

they're not looking outside the box that's not their job so it's not necessarily against doctors it's just

26:52

outside of their training they're not nutritionists and they're not interested

26:57

um it doesn't fit into the clinical practice guidelines here in the United States um

27:02

they they are kind of in the same situation as Canadian doctors Canadian doctors have to go by clinical practice

27:09

guidelines outlined for them by Health Canada and so you know if somebody comes

27:15

with this then this then this then this right it's the same thing here um with individual practices or when

27:21

they make their deals with insurance companies you know they can't step outside of those guidelines either or they risk

27:27

losing the practice so yeah not um they're they're

27:33

logical but not necessarily creative thinkers and I don't think that's their job a scientist on the other hand has

27:41

the responsibility to think way outside the box to be curious instead of just dismissing everything as anecdotal and

27:47

not not in the DSM you know um being curious and wondering why that

27:53

might be and then looking into it so I have a lot of respect for that career

27:59

choice I think that um I don't know if I had it to do all over again and a better brain I probably

28:06

would have chosen to be a scientist because I am curious and I wonder when something's working why is it working

28:13

and when it's not working why is it not working you know yeah asking those big questions and trying to prove yourself

28:18

wrong is very is very interesting yeah I completely agree with you and that's a perfect answer thank you

28:25

um who's the hero in the book is there one are there multiple Heroes

28:31

hmm I think there I have three Heroes

28:37

there's three okay four four Heroes all right I like

28:42

it I'm gonna do it like the sports the sports uh you know gratitude speech or whatever it's like a Marvel movie thank

28:49

God no really okay so ultimate healing came

28:54

to me when I was able to forgive a lot of um

28:59

a lot of wrongs done and a lot of things overlooked and missed and so I think the

29:05

the greatest hero in there is honestly um

29:10

he who has led me to a place where I really can forgive and that has that's

29:16

been huge for me so I I yeah I think the greatest fear was the savior in Jesus Christ honestly

29:23

when I um if you ask my dad how these answers came to him everything everything

29:29

including my real healing and my ability to be a mother and get past all the hurt

29:35

um comes down to to that to that ability to just forgive and let go

29:42

um and then I have to say that the there are three men in my life who I just

29:49

honor as Heroes and that would be my dad

29:54

um his original business partner David Hardy huge thinker

30:00

um my dad is such a fighter and my husband was such a stayer because I gave him every reason to leave

30:06

and he he stayed you know and um some of his insight

30:12

into my real pain you know in conversations in the middle of the night

30:17

led me to understand what I needed to forgive to begin with so I've just I've I've been really blessed

30:24

to have amazing men in my life and uh I don't think

30:30

that's something you hear very often given the current media but yeah

30:35

yeah that sounds like a dream team around there for sure and you know that's um

30:41

when it comes to the healing of anything we have to be we can't just think of

30:46

like one thing we can't just think medication or we can't just think nutrition you know we have to be thinking all of these things and if

30:52

you've got your you know your dad who's this incredibly highly motivated fighter and you've got your partner who's so

30:59

supportive and understanding and forgiving and then you've got David Hardy as well who's a really smart

31:05

thinker really creative you know like you've just you know you've kind of got like every every aspect of

31:12

that discovery of healing kind of covered I think that's yeah like that's that's amazing that's yeah that's her

31:17

that's heroic who's no doubt about it surely um hypothetically if your dad didn't exist

31:24

in this whole story with your experience with so many people who have experienced

31:30

the harshness of bipolar another and other disorders you know without your

31:35

dad's motivation strength Faith perseverance

31:40

what do you think your life and Destiny would have uh would have been something a lot of people might experience these

31:46

things without your dad for example oh I I know exactly who I'd be

31:52

um uh massively overweight recluse in a

31:58

trailer home with a lot of books period so you've obviously thought about

32:06

that before oh yeah there's no there's no chance that I would have um been able to Stave off the

32:13

um addictive behaviors that absolutely I would have had to go to for self-medication

32:20

um and and if I had stayed on the medication I'd be dead already I was not no I was never going to be okay so if I

32:27

survived I would have had to just withdraw and there's no way that I could function

32:33

in society at all if uh if I hadn't stayed on the medication but had stayed

32:39

sick I I don't I don't know I I think I it was it's between suicide and uh total

32:48

yeah okay mess I appreciate it I appreciate your honesty there thank you very much yeah because I think again not

32:54

not everybody would have had the the team that you had around them and like right now as we speak you know

33:00

there'll be people who are going through such very very difficult things without that and that's a massive part of the

33:06

problem obviously uh look I've tried to help people I've had conversations with women like me

33:13

um who are sick you know in real time like I was and um and without support

33:19

the fear of even getting better like the thought that they might be employable or

33:25

the thought that they might have a responsibility that goes beyond collecting the check or checking

33:31

themselves into the hospital is is just so overwhelming they can't even imagine a normal life and so yeah you have

33:39

having familial support and a good Community around me was a huge factor in

33:45

allowing me to get past that first year and then just trust that um you know even without disability I could

33:52

still be okay right absolutely absolutely

33:58

um for people who have a friend or a family member or maybe a student in a class or something who you know they

34:04

might suspect struggling with a mental health condition what advice would you have for them are

34:10

there any signs that you might look out for I think there's two -piece struggle the two kinds of people

34:16

that struggle there's the person that struggles that wants to get better and recognizes that they're struggling and

34:22

then there's the person that is struggling and needs to be right and maybe has some

34:29

personality disorder surrounding trauma that really isn't approachable about

34:35

that and so the approach is very very different if you have a friend who is struggling and they know it

34:41

then I think being very open about the struggle is really important and um and

34:48

with kindness and acceptance to just recognizing that this is an illness like any other

34:54

um even if it starts with circumstantial stress that eventually that gets to your brain and so when you're dealing with a

35:01

brain that is not functioning you know at Optimum level like it's okay to talk about that the same way that you

35:08

would talk about the broken leg or diabetes right um I was one of those people that knew I

35:14

was struggling and wanted to get better so I didn't um I wasn't insulted

35:21

when someone offered help right but I've also seen people who are gravely insulted when someone offers help and

35:28

that's a whole different situation you have to let them hit rock bottom and they have to discover it on their own that they need help so I think just

35:35

being an example of health and happiness and gently you know hey you ever need

35:41

anything I'm here for you then they know where to go right yeah because these things don't happen overnight right it's

35:47

not like yeah it's it's it's years in many many cases so absolutely yeah it's

35:53

um yeah that's interesting thank you from from all your experience with mental

35:59

illness and drug interaction side effects Etc and I know you've done so much research in regards to all of this

36:05

have you was there ever a really shocking discovery that you found whilst

36:10

going through kind of the Publications and the research

36:17

I think um the correlation between breast cancer

36:22

and antidepressant use really shocked me can you tell us a bit more about that

36:28

um I don't know the numbers off top of my head anymore it's been years since I read that stuff but

36:33

I just knew that that was something I could never do again like I realized wow what which

36:39

which part is life-threatening you know sometimes the The Cure can be worse than

36:45

the illness really and um and I I think that people really need to take

36:52

responsibility for the outcome and don't use a medication you don't

36:58

understand so if you need to use a medication research it and then weigh out those

37:05

pros and cons don't be afraid but weigh out the pros and cons for yourself and decide make an educated decision

37:11

um sticking our head in the sand and just swallowing whatever is handed to us is really unwise and I think we it just

37:18

promotes victim um victim culture um when people

37:25

end up with the results of that choice and don't feel like they actually picked it yeah so

37:33

um I don't know there's a lot there's a lot of really uh big potential for harm with certain

37:39

medications but also for some people it's it's a necessary

37:45

um scale you know absolutely yeah and being your own kind of Health Advocate and you know doing a little bit of

37:51

research and asking questions to doctors I think is a really important part of the process because if you're just

37:58

taking something for taking something you I feel like you're creating more of an internal divide and you're separating

38:03

yourself even more from what's going on for you well and it's got to go beyond asking your doctor because half the time

38:09

your doctor doesn't know okay so it's not your doctor's job to know the ins and outs of every medication that's the

38:16

pharmaceutical company they do the research and then they choose what information they're going to give to the

38:22

doctor and they give it in a little presentation or a pamphlet or or a you

38:28

know extra credit class or whatever so they're they're just they're able to

38:34

relay what they know but they are not psychopharmacologists they are the

38:39

doctor the prescriber and and so to say my doctor didn't tell me I I think that

38:45

is a bad excuse It's a lazy excuse for sure it is you know my morning reading

38:50

often is looking up a medication that I've heard of or that someone has

38:57

suggested that I take or that my kids take or whatever and then reading all

39:03

the shallow salesy stuff that they have to say about it and then digging way

39:08

deeper they all there's always The Links at the bottom where they um linked to all the studies and people

39:15

need to learn how to read and then read it and really like look at the data

39:21

and really consider what you're putting in your mouth yeah that's that's strong advice

39:28

absolutely um what is the I remember in your book you wrote there

39:34

was a part there was a part in the book and a part in your life I think it was on this kind of like road to recovery

39:40

where you talk about a how a shower is a was a miracle

39:46

um so like what can you describe what the promise of hope is and you know is it it's not is it the same for everybody

39:54

well I mean I think everybody's illness is different for for me

39:59

um when my editor suggested that we call the book a promise of hope I I originally called it

40:05

um these painted wings and and it was in reference to the

40:11

forgiving forgiving my mom when I saw that I was her and that her pain

40:17

um my pain was a shallower reflection of hers and that you know by forgiving her

40:23

I could also move forward and all of that right when he went with a promise of hope

40:29

um as the title I felt like I needed to explain that to myself

40:35

you know like um because it is different for everyone for for me I think the promise of hope

40:42

that I received was really in um in an experience that kept me from

40:47

committing suicide one day and I it was just that idea that there was life after all of this

40:55

and that um that there would be hope and it was long before my dad's Discovery it was really a spiritual experience for me

41:01

that I talk about in my book um but I think for other people sometimes a

41:07

show like yours is the promise of hope you know just the idea that somebody is talking honestly and openly about

41:14

things that most people know better than to talk about um those people that experience things

41:19

like my girl in the back brain know better than to talk about that because they know that that's odd right yeah so

41:26

I think just being open a more open Society talking about real

41:31

things and normalizing abnormal experiences really

41:38

um that is hopeful for people absolutely being comfortable in

41:43

uncomfortable situations I think is a very important thing for everybody to learn um because yeah if we just kind of go

41:49

along with what's happening and we don't think feel or say things that um that we

41:55

feel that don't fall into the Norms yeah we're always

42:00

just going to kind of speak cruising by and you're not really going to create any change if you if it's predictable

42:06

and it's familiar and it's known it's not it's not really going to work like that yeah it's true I think the people

42:13

um okay so so I so I attend a church right

42:20

and there's like 300 people in the congregation and everybody knows well many people

42:25

know my story because we're Facebook friends also or they've caught little bits of Gossip here and there about who

42:31

I used to be right okay and um I don't talk to anyone else about

42:37

anyone else's story I only talk about my own so it's really fun to see how many families

42:46

will come here and ask for help but don't want anyone else to know and yet

42:52

they're all sitting in the same building every Sunday like there's it's so common

42:59

Hallucination is common um trauma is common having been abused

43:05

is super common it's really common and we all try to live our lives like it's not and we all

43:12

think that we're alone in the world and I wish I could just you know grab the pulpit and just be like hey

43:18

it's all of you right like open up support each other a

43:24

little better it's all of you these are commonalities that connect us yes and and if people understood that and

43:30

weren't so ashamed of it they might actually do some healing instead of hiding absolutely because yeah we

43:36

internalize it we make it all about like us and we're not normal and we're strange and we have to pretend to be

43:43

this person that we think other people want us to be like yeah it's very

43:49

confusing and it's very inauthentic and yeah it doesn't it doesn't create those kind of connections especially in like a

43:55

community and in a group but you know it's all about you know healing and forgiveness and joy

44:01

and gratitude and all those things yeah you you kind of expect it to be a little bit different in those settings

44:06

but maybe it's the lack of Hope for healing like maybe it's the idea that we've all been sold this notion that

44:13

there's no cure so if there's no cure then there's no hope right so why would

44:21

you talk about it yeah maybe maybe that's where the shame part comes in having something that's

44:27

absolutely cannot be helped and and really I mean in a in a faithful Community you think that they believe

44:33

otherwise right but yeah so your your the book what what kind of what's so what's the

44:40

timeline from like your age at the beginning and then when you're done put the book

44:45

oh okay so I was four I think in my first memory of my mom in the garden

44:52

and I think it takes us through the battle so I would have been 32. okay

45:00

is there going to be a part two I'm living it right now is there going to be a part two that I

45:05

can read I know I'm thinking about it I've messed around a few times but I think I have

45:11

more to go I actually was just recently diagnosed with narcolepsy which is interesting to me because

45:17

um I suspect that a lot of my original symptoms um that were

45:24

untreatable and completely blown up by psychiatric medications and we're

45:30

probably early early signs of narcolepsy so kind of interesting

45:35

um but that's a whole other story I think okay okay

45:40

um how can people connect with you Autumn and where can people pick up the book I listen to it on Audible yes and

45:48

it's no longer available on Audible oh so when I recorded that book it was in a

45:55

studio in Toronto and um we Harper Collins had had um

46:01

contracted with a record maker so I went in and did it in their studio and it was one of the earlier

46:07

um versions of okay of audiobook so it was

46:13

originally put out on CDs and then um they were able to take it and put it

46:19

into an audible and something with the technology doesn't allow it to be sped up and slowed down in a normal way the

46:25

way that audiobooks are read so they've pulled it off so they just gave me back my

46:34

um my audio rights to the book and I'm actually thinking I might just rate it

46:39

in a podcast and give it away since I can but

46:45

um so right now paperback is the only way to get it and it is on Amazon it's available anywhere books are sold

46:50

through harpercollins so it could be ordered through a bookstore um it was published in 2007 so I don't

46:56

think you're likely to find it sitting on a bookshelf somewhere right now it's sold out in Costco during the book tour

47:02

way back then but it's it's still available as a book and then I guess keep your ears tuned for

47:11

um another way to hear it sure yeah I I think with a couple of searches and a

47:17

couple of clicks you could quite easily find it and get hold of it pretty easily yeah yeah and we'll uh I'll put up a

47:22

couple of links so people can get there a little bit simply um also and do you have a you have like

47:28

a a Facebook group as well right like a kind of support yeah let's talk about that okay so it's it's not huge and it's

47:34

just been one that we've kind of just been inviting people to as I've been helping them um

47:40

it's turning into a good community so we have uh feel better with Autumn

47:45

Stringham on Facebook and in the feel better group

47:50

um it's just a lot of people like me who are just at different stages of healing

47:56

but we have a fantastic open chat on Monday nights and so every Monday I go

48:02

live on a zoom and it's not recorded it's really we try to keep it private but we get a pretty good group

48:08

conversation going on there um some people are willing to share a little bit about wherever they are at

48:14

with their struggle and other people are flies on the wall and they just kind of want to listen in but uh it's turning

48:20

out to be something really special and we have great conversations everything from renegotiating your marriage after you

48:27

get better figuring out how to be healthy in a healthy relationship all the way through

48:34

um yeah I was on an SSRI and I keep sweating at night okay you know like

48:39

really simple stuff so yeah yeah no I think finding your tribe and fun in a community is a step towards you know

48:47

normalizing what we just kind of spoke about I think that's a really really important part of the process and you shouldn't go through anything that's

48:53

quite significant on your own um so yeah that's that's wonderful and we'll um we'll obviously make sure that

48:59

people can get hold of that as well please do I would love that any new friend is welcome there that's lovely

49:06

well well that's about it for today thank you so much for joining us today Autumn do you have any closing remarks

49:12

no other than just there isn't anybody that I've ever met that's beyond hope or help

49:20

it's possible and um and if it's not working for you there's a reason so you got to figure it

49:25

out and uh be open to those open to suggestion right absolutely well thank

49:31

you very much again that's awesome um so for more information on anything that we've spoken about in this episode please see the show notes and don't

49:37

forget to subscribe if you haven't yet thank you so much for listening everybody this is true hypercast the official podcast of true hope Canada

49:43

we'll see you next week thanks Simon foreign

49:50

foreign