0:00

What I'm trying to do with with teenagers and the anti-agism work is get

0:05

more people to look to look ahead and to plan and prepare because people who who

0:13

have a positive outlook on aging, they do that. They plan and prepare. They

0:18

don't just plan for what they're going to do, like what's my purpose going to be, that sort of thing. They also plan

0:24

for, oh, you know, if something happens, let me get all my documents in order and

0:30

let me make sure you know where my financial stuff is and let me make sure everybody knows what my plan is. Because

0:37

when we're not afraid of it, then there's no reason not to plan. Um, the

0:44

people who are afraid, they're the ones going, "Well, I'm just none of that's ever going to happen to me. That's just

0:49

never going to happen.

0:55

[Music]

1:00

Hello all and welcome to True Hope Cast, the podcast where we dive deep into the psychological and physiological aspects

1:06

of mental health. In a world that's both beautiful and wild, we bring you the motivation, inspiration, knowledge, and

1:11

solutions that you need to navigate life's challenges with confidence. Today we have a special guest with us, Corin

1:17

Orman, an inspiring advocate for overcoming agism and changing the conversation around aging. Corin is the

1:24

author of Teenagers and the founder of a thriving company that's making significant strides in care management,

1:30

addressing critical pain points for older adults. Her mission is to embrace aging with positivity, and she's here to

1:36

share her insights into how we can all shift our perspectives around aging. Before we jump into the conversation, be

1:42

sure to follow True Hopecast for more episodes filled with powerful insights and hit that notification bell so you

1:48

never miss an episode. For more information about True Hope Canada and how we promote brain and body health

1:54

through non-invasive nutritional means, please visit truehopcanada.com. Now, let's dive into today's episode.

2:00

Enjoy the show. Okay. Hi, Corey. Welcome to True Hope Cast. Thank you so much for joining us today. How are you and what

2:06

is going well? Um, I'm great. I'm great. Happy to be here. Um, what is going well today? I

2:15

don't know. It's been a good day so far. I I woke up this morning and put on some good music and I've been in a good mood

2:21

ever since. So, everything's going great. Excellent. Well, we'll try and keep that rolling then. That's fantastic. Um, so

2:29

we're going to be discussing overcoming agism in today's society. But before we

2:35

jump into that, can you just let us know a little bit more about who you are and what it is that you do?

2:40

Sure. So, my name is Dr. Karen Almond and I am a my day job is as a geriatric

2:48

care manager which means basically I help people navigate caring for aging

2:55

loved ones and kind of walk them through that whole process because most of us

3:00

when we become caregivers don't know what we don't know about the process and all the ins and outs of what they need

3:07

to do. Uh and that work actually has led me down the path of writing my book

3:13

which is teenagers where I really look at agism and how our perspectives on

3:21

aging particularly in western societies really impact and shape how we

3:29

experience the aging process. Because what I see in my care management practice is that people who have a

3:36

positive outlook about aging, they have planned. They have they are looking ahead. They're thinking that there are

3:43

good things ahead of them and they do all the things like go to the doctor,

3:50

exercise, do all their legal documents to make it a really good experience.

3:56

And then I have other clients who have because of their fear around aging and

4:02

all the negativity that we have so much of in our culture, they've buried their head in the sand

4:09

and they've kind of said that aging thing is not happening to me and I don't

4:14

really need to plan or prepare. And that has led them to some pretty detrimental

4:20

outcomes based on that fear. And so that's how I got to where I am right now.

4:27

Interesting. So your mission is to I guess change the conversation around

4:32

aging, you know, and that's pretty inspiring thing to do because it's not a it's not a typical conversation piece

4:39

really. If anything, I think that we try to avoid talking about getting old and

4:45

talking about death as much as we possibly can. And I guess what I guess what from what I've observed in the UK

4:53

and in and uh in Canada where I've lived is that a lot of people end up putting their

5:00

parents in these homes, right? And which, you know, I'm not saying is a

5:06

terrible thing or a bad thing because I'm sure there are good facilities and there's going to be bad facilities, but

5:12

that is a very new thing in human culture to do. and our evolution in

5:19

regards to how we would treat and see and and respect and behave and with our

5:25

elders. This is is a very new thing that we would put them in this separate building

5:30

block away from our actual family. So I wanted to ask you like what do you what how do you see the evolution of how

5:37

society especially in the western world is like treated elders? Well I mean things have changed so much.

5:45

Um, you mentioned uh maybe putting someone into a facility or a community

5:50

of some kind. You know, part of that that happens for a couple of different reasons. It happens because we live so

5:57

far apart now, right? Maybe you would really love to have your mother, father,

6:03

aunt, uncle live with you, but you live in another country or another um, you know, just another area far away and

6:10

it's not feasible for you to do that. So just how far apart we live. That's one thing. The next thing is that the

6:18

longevity. We are living longer and we're living with more chronic

6:23

conditions than we have ever had before. And some of those I'm thinking like

6:28

diabetes, things like that. Some of those come with some complex things you

6:34

have to do to manage those conditions. And so, you know, when we think about

6:40

caring, like having someone live with us and caring for an aging loved one, we

6:45

often don't think about the complexity of the medical care that sometimes we

6:52

need when we have multiple chronic conditions. And so, it's more than just

6:58

the average person with no medical training can actually do. And so that

7:05

leads to this issue. The the other thing is, you know, we talk about how much

7:12

it's changed in terms of just how we think about older people. You know, before we had the internet, you know,

7:19

older people in our societies, they were the repository

7:24

of all the knowledge because they had been around for so long. They knew all

7:30

the things. And if you wanted to know something in your community, you went to them. And today with the internet, we

7:39

just Google it, right? Like we just look it up. We don't have to go ask someone

7:45

who's been around. They're they're not looked at or used as those repositories of knowledge that they would have been

7:52

revered for having all that knowledge in previous generations.

7:58

Yeah, that's super that's a super interesting point in regards to the access to information and where you

8:03

would actually go and obtain that and um you can do that from obviously from your

8:09

smartphone or anything. So yeah, that's that that's a really important point and I think kind of looking back you know

8:14

whether it was like a 100 years ago or 200 years ago when you know three four generations of people would be living under the same roof. Today we live in a

8:22

very we live in a very different world. You know, people are scattered ac across the planet. You can't you know most

8:27

households need to have two incomes. So like you know there's nobody to be there to actually care for that indiv that

8:32

that that elder that individual. Like there's so many aspects now that we have in 2025 that don't particularly

8:39

correlate with you know how things I don't know say used to be or however or however you want to word that. Um I

8:46

imagined um you know growing up with you know my grandparents in the house and my

8:54

mom and dad would be off to work and the grandparents would take care of the grandkids and that would kind of like go

8:59

through but as you say like we don't really it's very rare to I think see and

9:04

experience that that anymore. Um, so things certainly have to change. But

9:10

just in regards to your like first initial drive and step into this work, into this

9:16

world, like can you share maybe what sparked your passion address addressing agism and why you think it's such an

9:23

important issue today? Well, again, I I kind of see it in my

9:29

geriatric care management practice, how how different people's views on this

9:34

actually impact what happens to them as they age. And then I think, you know, I

9:41

just turned 50 this year and it's one of those things where I kind of stopped and

9:47

went, you know, this aging thing is happening to me, too. Mhm. I think I think we all kind of go along

9:53

and don't really think about it until we get to an age and maybe it's different

9:59

for every single person where we go, "Oh, right." Like, and really everyone

10:05

should care about agism because agism doesn't just impact older people. It

10:10

impacts younger people. If you've ever been told you were too young, you were too inexperienced for a job, you know,

10:18

you don't know anything because you're only fill in the age, you know. So, it's it's not like it's just impacting older

10:28

adults. It impacts all of us at different stages and it will impact you

10:33

if it hasn't already. It will impact you if you are lucky to live long enough,

10:39

right? And so we really should all care about it. But I I think just yeah just

10:45

the work and seeing how differently people approach it and then my own aging

10:50

process going you know this is this is dumb. There is so much to look forward

10:57

to as we grow older. And that's, you know, a lot of the stories I tell or

11:02

interviews I've done in the book are people who inspire me, who I look at and

11:08

I go, "Okay, I want to be you when I grow up." Right? They are living their best lives in their 60s and 70s. And I I

11:17

want to do that. And I think our narrative, our cultural narrative tries to tell me, "Oh, no, no, we're going to

11:24

be done with you by then. You should be ready to retire and do nothing." And that's not the story I want to tell.

11:33

Yeah, you make a great point in regards to agism and how that affects kind of everybody across across all walks of

11:38

life. Like my six-year-old thinks that he's a wise guru that knows everything about everything and you can't convince

11:45

him he doesn't. It's pretty it's pretty interesting. And then when he comes up to real life situations where he's

11:52

literally too young for something um then that that emotionally affects him.

11:57

And it's that emotional piece which is very a very interesting thing to to comprehend with through through all ages

12:05

of where you maybe want to be or what you want to do. And there might be roadblocks in the way of that or you might think there are roadblocks in the

12:11

way of that just because of your age. And yeah, it's it's it must be you must see the

12:17

psychological aspects of when age becomes like a real

12:22

real important part of somebody's consciousness. Well, and you know, I don't I don't

12:29

think it necessarily becomes part of our own consciousness until the world forces

12:35

it on us. I mean at some point something will happen in your life where you will

12:41

go oh you know well you go to the doctor and you've got an ache or a pain or

12:48

something and the doctor says well you know at your age we can expect and fill

12:54

in the blank. I mean, I can't tell you how many people have told me stories like that of that they had that kind of

13:02

moment where somebody else was judging them based on their age. And that was

13:08

the moment that they went, "Oh, wait. This is happening to me. This is not cool. I don't like this." And maybe it's

13:15

at the doctor's office. Maybe it's at work, right? Like maybe you get into your 50s and you think you're going to

13:22

get that next promotion, but you get passed over because they think, well, you're getting ready to retire. You

13:28

don't really you don't want that promotion or we don't want to continue to ve invest in your training because

13:34

you're you're going to be out the door in a few years. And you're sitting there going, "No, I'm not." Right? Like I I

13:40

still got good years in me. I want to keep learning and growing. So it's not so much I think that we we think it.

13:48

It's that the world starts to kind of force these messages on us and then that

13:53

shapes how we think about ourselves. Um I do have a friend who's a college professor and he's actually um in his

14:01

60s and one of the things he said was everybody keeps asking me when I'm going

14:09

to retire. When am I going to retire? And he's like I like what I do. I enjoy

14:14

it. what would I do if I retired? But because everybody keeps asking him, it's

14:22

making him think differently. He's like, well, should I be retiring? Are they trying to tell me something? Am I not

14:28

good at this anymore? And they're just too kind to actually say it, right? Like, what's the the messaging that

14:34

we're sending by just asking that question to somebody? And it must come to a point where people are starting to

14:42

look at the actual number, the age more than looking at the competency and the

14:48

quality and the things that those individuals bring. And then as you say like you know you could you know there there are there are professors in their

14:55

70s that are doing like amazing fantastic things. And why why is it just because they have this particular age

15:02

that you would think that they weren't able to continue doing the work that they're doing and being able to serve?

15:08

It's it's interesting because we don't this this number thing that we I don't know how long we've been like you know

15:14

aging ourselves like within society but it's certainly we have these these like

15:20

these milestones or something like that but the point you make about you go see a doctor and you have the aches or pains

15:27

or whatever and or the particular type of blood work but oh that's typical of your age and you should be looking to

15:33

you know take this drug or that drug because of your age and it's quite it's really stereotyping just because of

15:38

their age rather than looking at the individual and seeing you know what's going on for them. So that can't be a

15:44

particularly helpful practice. No. And but you know I think like with

15:50

with the college professor I don't think it's that people even maybe even know

15:56

his age, right? They're just they're just thinking they're seeing the gray hair and things like that and they're

16:01

thinking, "Oh, because of the narrative like we we have this cultural narrative

16:06

that says you get to a certain age and then you retire and that is your quote

16:12

unquote well-earned rest, right? And it's going to be sort of unlimited

16:18

enjoyment and bliss and don't you and you should want to do that. You should want to retire." And so I don't think

16:26

it's that they're necessarily trying to say something about him. It's just the cultural story that you get to a certain

16:33

point and then you retire. And when people don't follow that cultural story,

16:38

we go, "What are you doing? Why are you doing that?" And yeah, and that's

16:45

it should be the case that people can do whatever floats their boat in the sense

16:51

that if if you're enjoying what you're doing and you're good at it, then keep doing it. And if you don't, right, like

16:57

if you're in a job and you hate it, then absolutely retire. But then what's the

17:02

next thing, right? What's the next iteration of who you're going to be and what's that new journey going to look

17:07

like? Yeah. I've I'm sure everyone's heard stories of people who retire and then they they die within a year or two of

17:14

that because of that like lack of purpose and like I totally I totally believe that like people have been

17:19

driven for a certain certain period of time and not having like hobbies or a

17:25

plan or something you want to step into or a community you know a lot of people's community is their workplace

17:30

and their employees for such a long period of time and then you know that Monday morning from the first day of

17:36

their retirement it's like what do do here and it's a I guess it's got to be a scary place like it's there's no guess

17:42

about it. So having plans in place and I was just thinking in regards to how you

17:48

know young people and old people like communicate apart from like family

17:53

gatherings. I don't really hang out with old people too much whether I'm like or

18:00

I'm at like my local YMCA where I'm going to the gym and there's like you know older people there. I like to kind of say hi. But I'm kind of in my 40s

18:06

now. But like for those remember when I was a teenager the only time I'd ever really speak and hang out with an old

18:12

person was like my grandparents and I think that's I don't know if that's wild I have to guess it that's

18:19

wildly different from many generations ago when we were you know living with these individuals and they might be our

18:24

primary caregiver for long periods of time. Mhm. So, I just try and imagine like putting an 80-year-old person and a

18:32

16-year-old person today now in a room, complete strangers, and then watching

18:37

that unfold. I think that could be a very interesting Netflix series, just having them sit there.

18:43

Yeah. Well, they've done some of those types of things, having um there are some programs that have like younger

18:50

teenager type people go in and like work with older retirees like in retirement

18:56

communities with their iPads and their computers and teaching them to do things. And and you know the biggest

19:04

the biggest pro of intergenerational interaction is that when you get people

19:11

together, it's just like with any other stereotype, the best way to combat the stereotype is to interact with those

19:19

people. So the the young people have stereotypes about the older adults and then they interact with them and they

19:26

go, "Oh, they're just people, right?" And they're like my grandparents. Most people, if you ask them, they'll be

19:31

like, "Oh, I love my grandparents. They were fantastic." So, we have that, "I love my grandparents, but then I have

19:37

these really awful stereotypes about every other older adult that exists." And they they if you get them

19:43

interacting, they realize, oh, no, you know, these are these are people. They're just they're people just like

19:50

your grandparents are. And vice versa. We have all kinds of stereotypes about young people, this younger generation

19:56

today. You know, they're this, that, and the other. And when you get people interacting, they begin to see each

20:03

other as people and not as the stereotypes that they've kind of just believed because they're out there.

20:10

Yeah. Yeah. That's that's great. And I I Yeah. It's interesting because you we've got

20:16

this this world of like X and Twitter now where people are happy to be so horrible to each other like through

20:22

comments, but if you were to actually get those people in a room and have a human interaction, I don't think they'd

20:28

ever say the things that they would say, you know, on on a digital platform. So, there's a massive component to that

20:34

human element of understanding each other a little bit more. And I think a lot of people have got examples of how

20:39

they've met strangers and they've ended up being learning a lot from them and getting and getting quite close and forming those relationships. But in your

20:47

in your book teenagers, you discuss how society often, you know, avoids talking

20:52

about aging as if it's like unavoidable. How do you suggest we start like

20:58

normalizing these conversations to change public perceptions of aging? Well, one of I mean in the book I do a

21:06

lot of interviews with people who are doing really interesting fun things as

21:13

they grow older and I think the number one thing we have to do is change the

21:18

narrative around growing older. So much of it is negative, right? Even just so

21:24

teenagers with a K. Um, I chose that word because the definition of keen

21:30

means like having a strong interest in something, right? You're keen on it. Um, and also being sharp, right? Like

21:37

you're sharp or intelligent. And one of the things that the reason I did that is

21:43

because when I was trying to write a book about the positive aspects of aging

21:48

and all the things there are to look forward to, there are almost no words in the English

21:55

language that are positive about older adults. Some of them are neutral, older

22:01

adult, senior, but we've got a lot of words that are negative. crone, old hag,

22:09

witch, just um dirty old man. I mean, just all

22:14

these things. And it's like there's no positive words. And the language really matters. Language shapes how we think

22:22

about things. And so much of our language around growing older is

22:27

negative. And we really have to change that because everybody's going to have challenges as

22:32

they grow older. I'm certainly not saying that people don't have health challenges or that things don't change

22:39

as they get older. But what I see in my practice and then in all these

22:44

interviews I've done is how resilient we are and how many things people are doing

22:52

in spite of any sort of health condition. you know, they are out starting nonprofits, running businesses,

22:59

volunteering, doing all kinds of impactful things in their quote unquote

23:05

retirement and yeah, they had a heart attack previously or they've lived

23:10

through cancer. There's all this stuff, but also

23:15

so much that you can do and look forward to. It's not all doom and gloom or all

23:22

downhill, but we've we've got to tell the full story. I'm not trying to tell a polyiana everything is perfect story,

23:29

but the only story we really ever hear in our culture, in our narrative, in our

23:35

TV shows, in our books, is the negative one that, oh, your health is going to decline and it's all going to be

23:41

terrible and nobody's going to want you for anything and just all this stuff

23:46

that makes people afraid. And that fear is what keeps them from planning,

23:53

preparing, figuring out what they're going to do in their retirement so that once they retire and they get up on that

23:59

Monday morning, they have purpose and clarity about what they want to do next. Um, we've got to tell the full picture

24:07

and we don't do that right now. No, absolutely not. And I think that um

24:12

I think we have a responsibility as like you know within different generations to to start changing that narrative as you

24:19

say like the language piece is very very important and obviously work that you're doing and the people that you you

24:25

interview and work with obviously have a a very keen passion for this and I think everyone really wants to listen to this

24:31

podcast will recognize that. Um but just thinking about like the health and well-being of older adults and how you

24:38

know this this ages agism piece can have a significant impact on an individual's

24:44

health and wellbeing. Um how do you see the cultural shift that you're

24:49

advocating for translating into like real world changes in society's

24:55

attitudes towards aging? Well, I hope that as we start to change

25:01

this narrative, we will see more intergenerational interaction like we

25:07

were talking about before. I hope we will start to value I mean the number

25:12

one thing I would love to see happen is for people to look forward to growing

25:19

older to instead of seeing it as all downhill thinking okay what's what's the

25:25

next version of me going to be after I quote unquote retire

25:31

thinking about you know you hear all the time in the news about the silver

25:37

tsunami or the gray a wave about how the population is aging and and this is

25:42

presented to us like it is the downfall of society, right?

25:48

Uh if we could reframe that to go, okay, so

25:53

we've got 10,000 baby boomers turning 65 every day or 75 or whatever the age you

26:01

want to look at where you know that people are moving into. And we could frame that and go that is a lot of

26:09

experience, wisdom, time because a lot of them are retired

26:15

time and energy. How can we utilize that? How can we is it is it having them

26:22

continue to work if they want to? Is it having them volunteer? Is it having them, you know, assist with caregiving?

26:29

And everybody can pick kind of, you know, pick your own adventure. But instead of looking at it like, "Oh, this

26:36

is awful." Instead going, "How do we how do we utilize this power of this

26:42

generation to benefit everyone, including those older adults who do want

26:48

purpose and a reason to get out of bed every day." And that shift, I think,

26:54

would be incredibly transformative for everyone in the culture, not just the

27:00

older adults. with the older adults that you've worked with and you've experienced and that you've you've spoken with, how um how

27:08

prevalent is is faith and religion when it comes into into aging and does do you

27:14

feel that that affects those individuals um let's say how they you know conduct

27:22

that let's say final 30 years of their life. You know, it's interesting and

27:28

research does show that as people grow older, they tend to become, I'll say, more spiritual. Not necessarily more

27:35

religious, per se, but more spiritual as they grow older. And that probably has

27:40

something to do with um the the sense of a shortened like if you think about the

27:46

road, how much when you're looking out at your long view, we all have a sense of how much roadway we think we have in

27:52

front of us. And as we start to sense that that roadway gets shorter, um

27:58

people tend to become more spiritual uh as they grow older. But older adults are

28:04

a diverse group just like, you know, middle-aged adults and kids, they are

28:10

not all the same. And so you can't just assume that somebody is spiritual or

28:15

religious because they are an older adult. you know, they're all individuals just like every other time in their life

28:23

they were all individuals. But we do kind of see that trend as people get older of increasing spirituality

28:30

probably because they're thinking, hm, what's going to happen next? Yeah. Yeah. It's just from my my

28:36

experience. So, you know, my my church is is probably I don't want to say like 50 60% people over over 60

28:43

and they're like the happiest, smileiest, most approachable individuals with the best skin. Like they just look

28:50

awesome. Um and I think it's because they just like smile all day and they just, you know, project positive neurochemistry.

28:57

Yeah. Um that is good for you. Yeah, it's certainly good for you. Absolutely. and you know they they they spend most

29:05

days together in like the different clubs and communities that they do and they have this you know and there's a

29:10

there's a varying degree of I want to say religious faith I guess like some

29:16

people were just there to just to just be a part of a happy group you know um so I've certainly seen that

29:22

w within those settings within those groups that that that communal piece being so important to be part being part

29:29

of essentially a club where everyone knows your name and everyone's there smiling.

29:35

So, there's there's a couple of things there. Number one, socialization is incredibly important, right? Like if you

29:43

want to not be depressed as an older adult, not you want to reduce your health problems, having social

29:50

connections and social activity is incredibly important. Yeah. Um the

29:55

second thing there though is also there's research on what they call the U curve of happiness, right? A U curve

30:02

like the letter U. And what that research shows is that we tend to report

30:08

being pretty happy like in our late teens, early 20s. We get into midlife

30:14

and things get stressful, right? Because we got kids and jobs and all the things. And then the highest levels of happiness

30:21

are reported by people in their 60s,7s and 80s. So that's another one of those things

30:27

that people think, oh, old older adults are all going to be depressed and sad. And the actual research shows that the

30:33

exact opposite is true. Um, if you have an older adult who's depressed and sad, that needs to be treated. Um, go go find

30:41

somebody to help you treat your clinical depression, things like that, because that is not normal. It is normal for

30:47

older adults to actually report very high levels of happiness.

30:52

Yeah, I can believe that that U curve just makes sense. I've never even heard of it, but I can I visualize it and that

30:58

makes a lot of sense. I'm I'm 41. I've got two small kids and, you know, it's busy busy busy and

31:04

um it, you know, I have to actively take very good steps to, you know, stay to

31:10

stay stay healthy like physically and emotionally. Um, and I also like, you know, one of my big motivators to, you

31:17

know, make good nutritional choices, um, and lifestyle choices is the fact, yeah,

31:22

I want to be a healthy 60, 70, 80 year old, right? And I'm kind of making decisions now to

31:28

invest in that time because, you know, I've, you know, I've experienced with with my parents and older individuals

31:34

that, you know, not taking care of themselves in those keen year in those in those key years can really have an

31:40

impact in your health. and I really don't want to be somebody who's relying on medications all over the place to to

31:47

deal with my my pain and my all these sorts of things. So, that's a huge big motivator for me because I've seen how

31:52

so many people do struggle with that. Yeah. Um and if I could do anything to those

31:58

individuals around me at a similar age, it's like, listen, now is the time to really take those steps towards um being

32:07

really healthy in your retirement. And if you want to talk, you know, we can talk all day about like Alzheimer's and

32:12

dementia and how the beginning of those um conditions, you know, begin a lot

32:17

earlier than the onset of them. Mhm. That can motivate a lot of people to, you know, really find that

32:26

really find that light bulb moment for them rather than like, you know, this short-term January diet thing, new year

32:32

that lasts a couple of weeks. You know, we're talking about like the rest of our lives and and being h happy and healthy.

32:37

super important. Um, so you run a company, you know, that focuses on care management and I wanted

32:44

to know what are some of the critical pain points that you encounter and how does your work directly address these

32:52

issues um in the context of agism? So the the pain point that we see the

33:00

most is that people don't think about their own aging and

33:08

therefore don't plan and don't prepare for it. And then we end up getting phone

33:15

calls that go something like, you know, mom's been independent and totally fine

33:22

and everything's been great until and now some sort of crisis has

33:28

happened. And now we as the adult children or spouse, we need to know

33:35

everything there is to know about the health care system, the kind of care

33:40

that's available, how do we get it, how do we pay for it, how do you um

33:46

coordinate all of it, because that, you know, doing that, caring for a loved one who's had some sort of major event is a

33:54

full-time job. It's trying, you know, trying to figure everything out to help plan their recovery and take care start

34:00

taking care of the house, right? like somebody needs to mow the yard and somebody needs to fix the sink and just

34:06

all the things that that's the moment we get the phone call and we, you know, we kind of joke

34:13

that we're like part-time therapists and then um adult daughters for hire because

34:18

we step in and do all the things that those family members would maybe want to

34:24

do, but they also have full-time jobs and kids of their own and a bunch of other stuff going on. they can't just

34:31

abandon their lives to to do this. Yeah. And so that's the pain point and you

34:37

know the we can step in and help but again I think what I'm trying to do with

34:43

with teenagers and the anti-agism work is get more people to look to look ahead

34:50

and to plan and prepare because people who who have a positive outlook on aging

34:57

they do that. They plan and prepare. They don't just plan for what they're going to do, like what's my purpose

35:04

going to be, that sort of thing. They also plan for, oh, you know, if something happens, let me get all my

35:10

documents in order and let me make sure you know where my financial stuff is and

35:15

let me make sure everybody knows what my plan is. Because when we're not afraid

35:21

of it, then there's no reason not to plan. Um the people who are afraid,

35:26

they're the ones going, "Well, I'm just none of that's ever going to happen to me. That's just never going to happen."

35:32

And I I mean that wishing it so doesn't make it true. And so that that, you

35:38

know, that's how the two pieces fit together because I want more people

35:43

looking forward to it and planning for it because doing that will actually make your whole experience go better.

35:51

Yeah. I guess it's a sense of denialism that people um put into their forefront

35:56

that that doesn't make them want to look Yeah. 5 years, 10 years, 20 years into the

36:03

future. Can that be a difficult thing? My wife and I have um very different

36:08

ways in looking into the future. I I I'm very much present like daytoday like you

36:13

know what can we do like in the now? What's in our reality? And my wife's like looking 10 20 30 years ahead. And

36:19

it's great that we have both of those perspectives because somebody certainly needs to be um like guiding the ship in

36:25

the now, but also somebody needs to have the map, you know, like what's the destination and and we I feel like we

36:32

should be doing that as individuals. We should be doing that as families. We should be doing that as as a married couple. Um because life's going to

36:39

change. Like when my kids hit 18, 20, like we're going to have small kids in the house for not very long. And

36:45

um I'm trying to cherish every moment of that. Even though when they're just absolutely bananas, it's very difficult

36:52

to find the patience and find the part of my brain that's like these guys are six years old in 12, 13 years that's

36:59

going to go by in a blink and they're not going to be in the house anymore and they're going to be adults and hopefully they want to hang out sometimes, but

37:05

they're not going to be these cute little snuggle bunnies for long. So again, again, it's like planning

37:10

planning for that piece. How can I be part of my kids' lives when I'm when when they're out of the house? And like I want to be robust enough and be

37:18

healthy enough to run around with them still when they're 20, 25. You know, I don't want to be the one that has to sit at home while I go play golf or go

37:24

hiking. You know, I want to be in there. I want to saturate every possible moment of love I can with my family. And that's

37:30

again, it's a motivation now for the next 30, 40, 50 years of my life. Yeah. If you think your six-year-old uh

37:37

thinks he knows everything now, wait until he's about 14, 15. I've got four teenagers at home right now and uh yeah,

37:45

I I don't know anything and they are they know everything. So, just wait.

37:50

I can't wait for that. Yeah. It's I I feel like there's just an evolutionary piece there where it's like as soon as

37:55

they get old enough to be able to like, you know, fend for themselves, you know, literally like take that um that right

38:02

of passage to become adults, they have to push every possible boundary to show

38:07

show their primary caregivers, their parents, that they're going to be okay. They're going to survive. It's all

38:14

right. I got it. I got it, Mom. I got it. I don't I don't Yeah. Yeah. And and us as parents, like

38:20

there's there's got to be there's, you know, I hope I've got the patience to be like, "Yep, okay." Rather than, you

38:26

know, saying, "You don't know anything. What are you talking about? This is how it is." Well, what you have to do is just keep your mouth shut and let them go. Let

38:33

them go do the dumb thing. And then, and then I have had a few moments of

38:38

enjoyment when my oldest has come back to me and been like, "You might have been right about that."

38:47

And with a broken arm in the hospital. Yeah. Yeah. I was like, Mhm. Okay. Thank you.

38:53

I actually have him on video one time. I I was I recorded him going, "I'm sorry, what' you say?" He's like, "You were

39:01

right." Oh, unreal. Yeah. Things to I mean, again, like things to plan for, please, things to to to get prepared for in the

39:08

moment because those things happen real quickly in our lives. And it's good to be able to set yourself to be able to

39:15

process through through those moments and and enjoy them. and hope hopefully everyone graduates and continues to

39:22

learn things as they go forward. Mhm. Um I'd love to talk to you about nutrition and food a little bit because

39:28

um you know here at True Hope we're a mind and bodybased supplement company and we've worked with a lot of uh

39:33

elderly individuals. I think the majority especially here in Canada like 79 80% of Canadians use natural health

39:40

products and the majority of those individuals are women over 60. That's just like the statistics. Um, and you

39:48

know, I travel around the the interior of British Columbia here to different health stores to to talk about our

39:53

products and talk to retail store staff and the majority of their their customers fall into those categories. So

39:59

they're super so a lot of them especially in this part of the world are very invested into their health into

40:05

natural options um before you know trying pharmaceuticals for certain conditions. Obviously that you know

40:11

every individual is different and they obviously have to work with their doctor for the certain things that they go through but natural medicine is a is is

40:19

a interesting thing for for older people that they step into. Mhm. And I'd love to ask your opinion to what

40:26

you've seen in regards to especially when this ages agism piece where

40:32

those individuals might be feeling negative towards you know society's opinions and perspectives towards them.

40:39

you know that can lead to anxiety, that can lead to depression and we know the path that takes with individuals. It

40:46

leads to isolation, probably not the best nutritional choices, alcohol, uh other substances, etc. And we know what

40:53

that does to individuals nutritional levels and nutritional potential. So I

40:58

wonder what have you seen in regards to the the the older individuals that you work with and their um perspectives when

41:05

it comes to the role of food and nutrition etc. Well, you know, it's it's very interesting because as we age, uh,

41:13

our taste buds change. This is just a known fact. And so, one of the things

41:19

that tends to happen is people really start to want food to be spicier or

41:26

saltier or sweeter because that's what tastes good. And so you you have this

41:33

kind of pushpull between what is what is nutritionally good for me, right, versus

41:38

what actually tastes good to me. And I I see a lot of older adults struggle with

41:44

that where they start to want to only eat things that taste really good, uh,

41:51

but maybe aren't that good nutritionally. And that's, you know, where you get into maybe needing some supplementation of some kind to assist.

41:58

We had one client who um all she wanted to eat ever was refrigerated cookie

42:05

dough that you you know buy at the grocery store because and and she was very clear about that is what tastes

42:12

good to me. That is what tastes good to me and she anything else u her daughter

42:17

or we tried to get her to do uh you know was really a struggle and so you know

42:23

they did resort with the help of her doctor to supplementation. um in other forms there because they

42:30

just couldn't they couldn't get her to eat anything but refrigerated cookie dough. Wow.

42:35

So um you know you certainly see it there and it it is a struggle for a lot

42:41

of people. The other thing we lose as we grow older is our sense of thirst and so

42:46

it's very very common for older adults to become dehydrated because of that because they just don't feel thirsty and

42:54

then that leads to all kinds of health consequences. um in terms of UTI, um

43:00

cognitive changes, you know, you've got to stay hydrated. And so, you know, it certainly is an issue for our older

43:07

adults, um because we just don't eat the same way as we grow older as we did when

43:13

we were younger. Yeah, that's interesting. I guess I think just looking from my nutritional

43:19

background about how, you know, maybe those individuals, older individuals are moving way less than they used to. Maybe

43:26

there's some muscle atrophy happening there. Therefore, you know, that their requirement for water decreases and that

43:32

that thirst decreases as well. Um, yeah, so many aspects to it. You know, we know

43:38

how how neurological our gut is and how much of our immune system sits within

43:43

there. And you know, if we are we don't have a diverse diet, how much that changes our taste, how much is that

43:49

affects our microbiome, which again affects our neurochemistry. So, you're you're saying her the the cookie dough

43:56

eating lady maybe her microbiome was not not doing so great. Maybe like I'd be very interested to

44:01

have a conversation with her like a year before this cookie dough fetish like what was going on for her. Maybe she

44:07

lost a grandchild. Maybe she lost a child. Maybe she lost her husband. Maybe it's very connected to um you know a

44:13

depression or a PTSD or something like that. And you know I bet she was actually very particular with the type of cookie dough as well. Maybe that has

44:20

a uh um some sort of um memory. I'm not

44:25

sure. I don't know. I like I have I usually have like a two or three hour consult with my nutritional clients before and get a full on full on

44:31

history, but there'd be a lot of questions there. I should have had you on call back then. That would have that would have been

44:36

helpful. Like get to the bottom of this for me. M and sometimes those answers are really simple for people like you

44:41

know like I I can't imagine so many clients I've had where their eating

44:47

issues or their depression or their sleep problems happens literally a month after like one of the worst things that

44:53

happens to them and they never correlate the two things. They've like even after 10 20 years of struggling they've never

44:58

never correlated the two things and they've just got these things that they need to work through. Um but we're kind of getting off a little bit off topic

45:05

there but that that's that's all good. But yeah, I just in regards to the nutritional piece, I just know that it's

45:11

important now like as a 41y old man, like I've got to nutritionally set my body up for the next 10 years, 20 years,

45:18

30 years. And that's obviously got to do with, you know, I like to lift weights so I can keep my muscle mass up. Um,

45:24

bone strength important. You know, there's been a massive craze on just just taking like a calcium supplement or

45:31

a magnesium supplement, but we do need many different other minerals to make up the matrix of our bones. So, have making

45:38

sure we're taking products that are um high in the diversity of different

45:44

minerals, not just calcium, magnesium, but phosphorus, zinc, boron, and all these other ones. It's very important

45:50

that we're taking the right supplements as well because yeah, we can get drawn into just, you know, a bit of a narrow approach and love doctors. They're

45:57

fantastic, but they're nutritional understanding isn't the best in the world. But there are fantastic

46:03

nutritionists out there who do spend, you know, years studying and working with individuals on an individual basis

46:09

to figure out what it is that they might um be lacking and what's best suited for

46:14

themselves and their lifestyles. But yeah, it's uh it I want to say it's a

46:20

tricky thing, but it's not when you have conversations with the right individuals and you work with the right companies and work with the right products. And

46:26

that's what we that's what we try to do here at True Hope is to make sure we have like an individual

46:31

bio-individual approach for those the four people. So when they do get into their later years, you know, we people

46:39

aren't struggling with chronic nutrient deficiencies. And that's what we see with a lot of people from unfortunately

46:44

like young young people from 10 years of age, a lot in teens right now. These chronic nutrient deficiencies that

46:50

they're in end up becoming these psychological conditions such as anxiety and depression. And once we, you know,

46:56

we've worked with so many people that once we recalibrate and reutrate

47:02

people's brains and bodies, they can start to feel a lot lot better. And that's kind of like the key thing that

47:07

they can then catapult from to maybe think about eating better, exercising a

47:13

little bit more, what being within community and family a little bit more, and you know, doing all

47:18

the other things that we know are vital for people's mental health. And there's no difference between, you know,

47:24

nutrient deficiency when you're when you're old and nutrient deficiency when you're young. There are things out there that people can do and work with to to

47:30

help rectify that. Um but in regards we're coming up to 45 minutes here already. Wow, this has flown by. Um

47:38

so your work seems to focus a lot on shifting the narrative around aging and I think everyone can kind of agree how

47:44

vital that is. But how do you think society's I don't know negative attitudes towards aging impact the way

47:52

older adults view their own health and well-being including their relationship with you know their mental health and

47:59

nutrition? Well, I think it becomes this almost sort of self-fulfilling prophecy

48:05

in the sense for some people, not for everyone, but you know, we all have

48:10

heard the negative stereotypes around aging, right? Y and again, we go through so much of our

48:17

lives um not really paying much attention to knowing it, right? Like, and then people will make ages comments

48:24

or they'll make aegist jokes and haha, that's so funny. And then again, if you

48:30

live long enough, that becomes you because you reach older adulthood. And I

48:37

I do think people if they have kind of bought into those stereotypes all along

48:44

that it can become like this self-fulfilling prophecy of, oh well, it's all downhill and there's no real

48:50

point in me exercising. There's no I might I've made it this long. I might as

48:56

well just eat whatever I want at this point. I mean it it because if you really think that the downward spiral of

49:04

aging, and I'm putting that in quotes, if you really think that's true, well then it Yeah. Why Why would you bother?

49:11

There's no point, right? Like there's no you feel like it's inevitable and so

49:16

it's going to be terrible. Why why even bother to eat well or to exercise? And I have certainly seen people who bought

49:25

into that hook, line, and sinker. And that is the the thing that I want to

49:33

fight against the most. This idea that that that is inevitable and that there

49:39

is nothing you can do because just like what you were saying, you know, continuing, you know, your body is use

49:44

it or lose it. And if you as you move into your 60s and 70s are continuing to use it. You're continuing to exercise

49:51

and lift weights and feed it what it needs to be fed, you're going to do so much better than if you just kind of go,

49:59

you know, I've made it this long. I deserve to eat whatever I want and who cares because it's all downhill from

50:05

here anyway. I mean, and you're laughing, but that there are people who really have that kind of mentality and

50:12

it is so damaging. Yeah. Well, when you've got society on a mass having this

50:19

perspective, it turn it can very easily turn it into a reality for people and you say, yeah, I I I it made me think

50:27

about when um you know, a doctor is is giving somebody a, you know, a really

50:32

bad diagnosis on like a cancer for example, and the rate in which those individuals die within like a day of

50:38

that three month, six month, 12 month diagnosis is really really high. So that that that can have a huge impact on

50:46

somebody's psyche and you know and really kind of program into that belief system that this is as long as I've got

50:52

or you know this is the way it's going to be. I'm 60 now. This is just you know everyone else is taking loads of

50:58

medications and they're not going jogging anymore. They don't want to break a hip or something. Yeah. So it's

51:04

Yeah. It's you're absolutely right in regards to that like I don't know social perspective contagion I guess.

51:10

Yeah. And the power the power of belief the power of your own belief system your

51:16

own thought process like I one of the things I always say um when I'm giving talks or anything is that fighting agism

51:24

is an inside job and what I mean is that you got to fight it in here in your own

51:30

head first before you can start trying to fight it anywhere else because you've been you've

51:36

been cooking in this cultural soup a long time and You got to figure out how to get it out of here before you can

51:43

start worrying about it everywhere else. And it's not easy. I mean, I still catch myself saying things every once in a

51:50

while where I go, "What just came out of my mouth?" Right? Like, "What what did I

51:55

I had a my husband and I were traveling and I had a set of headphones and I was trying to get it to connect to my phone

52:01

and they wouldn't connect." And I said, "Oh, these are these are my old headphones. They're just tired and

52:07

cranky." And my and my husband looked at me and he was like, "Do you know what you just

52:13

said?" I was like, "Oh my gosh, but you I mean that's what I mean. We are so

52:18

like steeped in it that you say stuff like that without even thinking about

52:24

it." Right. But it's that's aism right there. That's right. Oh wow. Um well, finally,

52:31

you know, for our listeners who might be struggling with their own perceptions of aging or dealing with agism in their

52:37

daily lives, what would be your kind of top piece of advice to help them embrace

52:42

aging in a positive light and take charge of their own health? Um, I think number one, talk to some

52:50

older adults in your life, right? Like talk to them about like find somebody at

52:56

your YMCA, right? who's there exercising every day and talk to them and find out,

53:01

you know, what they're doing, what their life is like. And I am would be really

53:07

surprised if they don't tell you some inspirational things and you don't find

53:12

out some stuff about growing older that you didn't know. They're probably also going to tell you about, you know, a

53:18

health problem that they have. But that is one aspect of a very complex life.

53:25

And one of my favorite things to do is just talk to older people and get

53:31

inspired by them. I was at Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick Chick-fil-A is a restaurant we have here and um I was there the

53:37

other day and there was an older gentleman working. He basically was going around and like cleaning the tables and doing things like that. And I

53:44

spoke to him for a minute. He's clearly probably in his 70s. And I said, you know, what are you doing here? And he

53:49

said, "Oh, you got to keep going. You got to keep busy." And he said, "And I love it. I love interacting with the people. I love, you know, talking to

53:56

everybody. You know, he's what else am I going to do? Sit at home and be bored? And I was like, that's it. I mean, just

54:03

just interact with older people and get inspired to to become a teenager

54:11

yourself and, you know, design the older adulthood that you want to have. Don't

54:17

just accept the stereotype that everybody tells you. It's a beautiful

54:22

way to finish, Corin. Thank you so much for that. Um, what where is the best

54:28

place people can learn more about you and your work? Sure. So, that's my website, which is my name, karen almond.com. I'm going to

54:35

spell it c o r i n ne a u m.

54:42

Um, but that is where you can find more about me. You can find out about the book. Um, all the all the social links,

54:49

all the things. Amazing. Well, I'll make sure that all those links are in the show notes so people can just click away and find you

54:55

in all of those different places. But thank you so much again for coming on the show. Such an interesting topic.

55:00

We've not talked about this before on the show before. Uh but I think it's something everyone can relate with and we can all work towards creating um a

55:08

world where, you know, agism just becomes smaller and smaller. Yep. That's the goal.

55:14

That's the goal. Well, thanks again Cory for coming on the show and thanks everyone for watching, for listening. For more information on anything we've

55:20

spoken about today in the episode, don't forget to check out the show notes. You can subscribe if you want and leave us a review on iTunes. That is it for this

55:27

week. We will see you soon. [Music]